NBVegita

The problem is that with their extremists saddam is just the rallying point today. Tomorrow he will be forgotten and there will be a new rallying point. We can't not do something because it might upset some people in the middle east. I mean some of the middle east feels that all western powers should be destroyed.

You need to correct your history on what actually happened in mogadishu, but that is not the arguement. And my how you underestimate these people. It is people like you, who when in our government cause things like 9/11 to happen. We cant take any chances. Wire taps? You could tap every phone in america and not catch half the terrorists in our country. These people are extremely intelligent. Have you not researched the training and preparation they did for 9/11? You could be living next to one and never know it. By hanging him that takes care of problems for iraqi's and problems for us. They are going to attack us over any reason they can think of. Right now their rally is Saddam's death. Give it 2 years when we have the next president, and they'll find another excuse. It was not the united states choice to have him executed, and they would have had no right to stop the iraqi government from doing what is perfectly in their right to do. Saddam deserved to be hung. He was hung. Any fallout from that on the United States is not on our heads.

I take C++ over Java 7 days a week, and twice on sunday.

Did I ever say they would get the civilians in Iraq? There are hundreds of thousands legal, and illegal immigrants in the united states. You don't think any of them have a vested interest in saddam? You don't think any of them are extremist enough to capture american civilians and try to demand his release? And he would have been kept in Iraq. We would lose a ton of troops trying to make sure he can't escape. Iraq is their territory. You leave a large number of troops, they start getting killed, and our government loses twice, keeping troops in Iraq (which you have to assume that the iraqi government would even allow) and the deaths of these soldiers. Or you leave a small number of troops, and they never make it home to see christmas. Those people might not have the technology, but have you ever seen the movie Black Hawk Down? Ever heard of the Vietnam War? Technology isn't everything. This war in Iraq already proves that although we might be smarter then them when it comes to making bigger bombs and faster guns, when it comes to fighting battles in Iraq they have a thing or two to teach us. Keeping saddam alive isn't worth even one American life.

C++ > Java.

Not that big of a deal? Until it turns into a hostage situation where they take dozens, or maybe hundreds of U.S. civilians hostage to try to negotiate his release? As has happened many times in the past over such an issue. And of course for extremists they would have no means of breaking into a jail...yeah...just because they don't have satelites in space doesn't mean they fight with stones tied to sticks. They're extremely intelligent, and they would attempt it, more than once. And it wasn't George Bush or the american government that found him guilty, or ordered the death penalty, it was the Iraqi government. But why not just blame this on our government too. I mean !@#$%^&* if aliens invaded our world tomorrow, it would somehow end up being George Bush and the United States fault.

It would be ignorant to think that just because they're not as technologically advanced that they wouldn't attempt to break him out of jail. Idealism is not meant for the real world.

And then we have to deal with decades of radicals doing the same thing they're going to do in the following months calling for his release, and then also the attempts at trying to rescue him from prison. Great idea.

Much more humane than he was.

Is the 17th finally gone for good? Or are there people working on something for the zone? And if so, who is working on it, and what are they doing?

No matter how long the delay is, if someone just wants to spam on the forum, they will just create the account and do it tomorrow instead of today. I'm with the rest of the group.

I wasn't just refereing to you, I was bumping it to see if anyone else has opinions

agreed.

any other opinions?

Nothing like 300 crazed spartans to get the blood flowin!

First off its not like they took all of the palestine territories and made them into israel. And ok, so you support the fact that through imperialism the ottoman empire gained control over the area. In essence that is exactly what happened here, except it was a world supported imperialism. During WWI the British occupied and took over the palestine territories, which was then part of the ottoman empire. After WWI ended, the British mandate of Palestine was created by the UN granting the British administration over a large area of what was the ottoman empire including what is now Jordan, Israel and territories under Palestinian authority. This mandate was held in effect until one day before the UN created TWO states, the state of Israel, and melded the territories of Palestine into the state of palestine. Again, this was not done until the day after the British troops withdrew from the British Mandate. So if you look at things your way, being the ottoman empire was imperialistic and took over the territory. It should still be theirs. But then the British occupied the territory, and in essence took the territory away from the Ottoman empire. So it should be theirs. But they decided to give 55% of it to the Jews, and 45% of the Palestinians. Awfully nice of them to do. So now you want to dissolve the state of israel and give it back to who? The ottoman empire? If anyone has claims on it, it should be britian.

Yes ty. Now I can play games at work again

I fully support that the Native americans should be given their land back. And all over the united states we still have "Reservations" which are not owned by america, they are owned and governed by Native Americans, and as such they are exempt from all united states laws and taxes while on those reservations. But as you noted there are hardly enough Native Americans left to be given a country this size, or even a 10th of a country this size, but if they were given some areas they asked for, minus our major metropolitan areas, which would ruin our economy, give them some land! As to your talk about civilization advancing...of course it has. That is why using things like the U.N. this was possible. If not, you would just have the super powers taking over any country smaller than themselves. And its not like the palestinians (spell check) were just booted from the land. When the state of israel was created in 1948, for the first 2 years, Israel offered full un requited citizenship to all previous palestinians if they wished to take it. Instead they became hostile, which is understandible, and refused. So then Israel closed up shop because they did not want to admit any palestinians as civilians that were hostile towards their country. And before you even go there, If the united states gave all of say New York state to the Native Americans, and the Native americans offered me full rights, I'd stay. I'm about 1/8th Native American anyway. The only way I'd leave is if my fiance wanted to leave. I guess I don't see a problem with taking a group of people who have been battered and scattered to the wind so many times and giving them a place to call home.

Yes the israelies were there a long time ago. And that land was forcefully taken from them. And guess what, palestine just happened to be the imperialism that owned it in the 20th century. Napoleon suggested the establishment of a Jewish state in Palestine as early as 1799. [24] Throughout the entire 19th century and early 20th century, the return of the Jews to the Holy Land was widely supported by such eminent figures as Queen Victoria, King Edward VII, John Adams, the second President of the United States, General Smuts of South Africa, President Masaryk of Czechoslovakia, British Prime Ministers Lloyd George and Arthur Balfour, President Woodrow Wilson, Benedetto Croce, Italian philosopher and historian, Henry Dunant, founder of the Red Cross and author of the Geneva Conventions, Fridtjof Nansen, Norwegian scientist and humanitarian. The French government through Minister M. Cambon formally committed itself to “the renaissance of the Jewish nationality in that Land from which the people of Israel were exiled so many centuries ago". Even in faraway China, Wang, Minister of Foreign Affairs, declared that "the Nationalist government is in full sympathy with the Jewish people in their desire to establish a country for themselves. And you can add albert einstein to the list too...

Ok well even give me a reason for a peaceful dissolving of said country.

I have a question to ask of some people...why are some people so !@#$%^&* bent on the destruction of israel?

I've got skills at making the little guy kill the big guys...yeah...

And on a nother note, the ss generation is growing up. I have a full time career, while going back to college to finish another degree part time, and a fiance. SS hasn't fit into my life in a long time lol

Staff was fun...like 4 years ago lol

Too many long posts and reply's for me to read through.