Vidiot_X

JoWie, Thanks for the input. As I understand it the current SubSpace client/server arrangement works along the lines you described. I'm really guessing here but my observations lead me to believe this, perhaps you could outline it for me. I'm not locked into any scheme as of yet so I am flexible as to the server/client design. I do agree that designing a server as you described has the best chance at foiling cheaters and providing security. My main concern is server performance. Having 'thin' clients put the onus for collision and other calculations on the server. I'm a little worried about handling possibly hundreds of clients and all the calculations involved coupled with the network load. The server would of course not display anything graphically, but it is still an unknown for me. I also have to consider the platform targets I'm aiming at Windows, Mac and Linux. The network library I use has to be able to handle all three platforms. So this is going to have it's own set of limitations. On balance I believe your on the right track with your suggestions and I will give this some more thought. Thanks very much, =Rich=

Hi, Aside from all the engines in the game server/client design will impact Phoenix SS in ways that can only be thought of as making-or-breaking it's future. As I see it there are basically two ways to approach this. I could construct a dedicated server with all the bells-and-whistles or go with a simple "Quake" style listener server / client. There are of course advantages and disadvantages to both the most obvious being ease of use and bandwidth. To me a dedicated server implies large multiplayer numbers and large amounts of upstream bandwidth which for the average user will be a limiting factor firmly placing these kinds of servers in the realm of those who have access and a static IP address. The advantage of this kind of server is it's ability to have dedicated point of access and to easily communicate between dedicated servers allowing easy compilation of stats and other data. An alternative to the dedicated server is a listener style server / client that is part of the game and is used in many games out there today. This approach has the advantage of lower numbers of players per server and thus lower upstream data. The ability to report it's IP address to a central location which all clients can access. Instead of a handful of dedicated servers there could be possibly hundreds of listener servers. Because the server and client are part of the game it's very simple for the end user to create a server and also play in the game. The downside to this approach is statistical data exchange. Linking that many servers would a bit daunting and would require a centeral server for them to report data too. Another disadvantage is a limit on the number of players to somewhere between 25-50 players/clients at a time. So, I'm open to suggestions. I have to admit networking is not my strong point but I'm up to the challenge. If you have any ideas on the subject please let me know. L8r, =Rich=

Hi, Thanks to all who helped test the last networking attempt. It was very useful and the next version of Phoenix will be about a week away. I'm looking over to different network libraries and testing them out now. As soon as I choose one I can go forward with development. Thanks again for testing. -Rich-

Gallitin, You can go ahead and close up the server if you want to. I think I have it working on my end, by way of logging on to my own server using its WAN IP. There is a problem with the server design and I need to correct it before any further server test. The good news is that all of this testing has given me some valuable information. So thanks to everyone. I should have a new version up in a few days to a week that we can all start to play/test on with more solid server/client design. AS to linux it should be no problem to recompile for it. I will first need to setup a linux system wich I intend to do soon. Eventually I will compile for Macintosh as soon as I come across a bargain system that meets the specs. Thanks, =Rich=

Hi, I managed to figure out that I need to 'Bridge' my DSL modem to make it compatible with my wireless router. It turns out the the DSL modem has a router of it own and this was causing some conflicts. I guess I had two routers running at the same time. So, lets hope that's got it fixed. It's about 5:30 am here and I just got back online so I will try it again later today. Gallitin, flared and dezmond if your around check back here and I'll post a new IP and see if you can reach the server. Special thanks to Gallitan:) maybe you can run a server on your end too if you have got the time. See ya later today, =Rich=

K, Cool, still up and reading about this whole thing. You rock! =Rich=

Anyone else want to try to reach Gallitin server? Just so I know it's still up. IP: 24.94.188.156

Thanks Gallitin I will see if I can reach it. So far no go but I'm sure I'll figure it out. Ps: Does the computer go into sleep mode? maybe thats why the ship goes missing. -Rich-

OK. If you can leave it running for a bit that would be cool:) I can't connect using the IP you posted (that did not change?) so having your server running will help me figure out whats wrong on my end. Thanks! -Rich-

Cool, So you were able to connect non-local? I tried from here and could not reach you. If you can leave the server up for a bit, if your using Win7 is should run fine minimized. Thanks! -Rich-

The default port is 12345 for Phoenix. But the server is down at the moment while make a few changes. But give it a go and maybe I'll connect to you:) -Rich-

Grr..... Ok I am reading on this and I'm going to set the server PC as a single static IP. So standby as I will have a new IP address for the server. -Rich-

Hi, I now have the router firewall off and port forwarding enabled in the modem firewall which should work. Test if you can (fingers crossed) Thanks, -Rich-

OK, Thanks! I will have to admit all this networking stuff is a little daunting. If we have any experts out there let me know. I'm able to connect clients to the server on my local network so I know the server works and so do the clients. The issue is probably in the routers firewall, I have two, one in the modem and another in the wireless router so the next step I'll try is to remove the firewall in the router by setting the server computer to the 'DMZ'. This will bypass the router firewall and just leave the modem firewall. I'm going to leave the server running and hope someone has better luck. But, if you can help on these network issues let me know. Don't forget someone can also setup a server and see if you can get a client to connect. I'll post here once I've made changes to the router. Thanks, -Rich-

If you have tried to reach this server unsuccessfully you might try again. I enabled port forwarding in the router so this should make it reachable. -Rich-

No takers?

PS: Off for the rest of today (Beer Time) so I'll be back later tonight to answer any questions. I hope it works:) -Rich-

Phoenix SS a.40 Client/Server http://redeyeware.uphero.com/phoenix_ss/main.html Direct link -> http://redeyeware.uphero.com/phoenix_ss/phoenixss_a40.zip I had to post this on my site, can't upload attachments for some reason (gets to 800k and stops). Anyway download from this page. Current Server IP address: 69.179.106.36 ========================================= Hi, This is a client/server and will allow you to start to help me test out all of the frameworks involved. Once you run the executable you can select to run as a server or a client. If you select server you will need to post your IP address so the clients can reach you. If you select client you will be prompted to enter the IP address of the server and your name/nick. This next version includes collision which is working but has a few anomalies due to the fact that some bounding lines are present when they should not be. This will improve once I have the editor back-up and running. Basically I had to use the map I had handy and wrap all sides of the parts in bounding lines. This cause a bullet to slip through a weird wall bounce now and then. I will have a server running (see IP address above) you can use to test. Just remember this is just the start of things and will improve over time:) If you have problems please let me know here in this thread. Thanks -Rich-

Tonight (possibly tomorrow) I will be uploading a new server/client. It is a basic (very basic) 'listener' server and or client built into Phoenix SS so you can run it as a server or client. This will allow me to start testing all the various frameworks and start 'gelling' them together. The cool part is now we can start to actually test Phoenix SS online and start building the game. This next version includes collision which is working but has a few anomalies due to the fact that some bounding lines are present when they should not be. This will improve once I have the editor back-up and running. Basically I had to use the map I had handy and wrap all sides of the parts in bounding lines. This cause a bullet to slip through a weird wall bounce now and then. See ya tonight:) Rich

Hi, I have settled on a vector style collision system that should be fast and flexible enough. I have had to make it from 'scratch' so it took a little research but I think it's worth it. The basic design (for you programming geeks) will use lines to define collision boundaries and normal's of map parts. Objects like bullets, bombs, shrapnel and alike will either be a single line for collision or a circle. Basically I'm calculating the last position of a bullet and it's present position and defining that as a line, if the line intersects a boundary line of a map part object there is a collision. It's simple and fast. This will make the editor very useful for constructing maps as the user will be able to custom design the collision boundaries for each map part. Once the part has defined boundaries it can be used anywhere on a map. Ships will have collision boundaries defined much like parts. So, I'm working the above out right now. My goal is to make the frameworks I develop portable to other languages like Monkey which in time will open up access to I-Pad, Andriod, HTML5, Flash and more. The cost is in the research in making frameworks/systems highly portable. Look for another 'Sneek Peek'. I'll be posting something in a couple of weeks. L8r, Rich

@Arry, Thanks I have not installed a proper icon yet and will do that sometime when this projects in beta. I am not sure if full screen DX/OpenGL apps display in the Win7 preview window (for example Continuum does not) but I will check into it. I have changed the app title so the name will be right in the preview window. Thanks again, Rich

Working on collision today. I have it working, but still lots to do.

@Ceiu, Yup thanks. I've got it fixed The next version has much faster performance:) L8r, Rich

Hi, OK... I've fixed some more issues with DX9. It seems the driver I was using was not setup for 16bit color depth, so some programmer buddies of mine modified it so it will now. This should fix the 'black screen' and other issues. You should have all 16bit resolutions available in DX9 (as well as the other drivers). I have also synced all screen flips so is should display as clear as possible. Next thing is to improve speed. -=> EDIT: I wanted to add try both 32bit and 16bit modes. Some video cards (like mine) run great in 32bit but slow in 16bit (go figure). Thanks:) off to code, Rich phoenixss_client2_sp30C.zip

Hi, I still have lots to do but this version should work better. I have dropped the anamorphic wide screen on 800x600 and 1024x768 for now so set your wide screen monitors to aspect (no stretch). more to come. L8r, Rich Edit - Use file in first post.