Dr Brain Posted February 28, 2005 Report Posted February 28, 2005 I've never said it will cause economic collapse. Social, quite possibly, but not economic. And don't ask how I linked Europe to same sex marriage. YOU DID THAT.
Aileron Posted February 28, 2005 Report Posted February 28, 2005 Changing wedding traditions doesn't change the definition of marriage, a wedding is a ceremony, a marriage is a lifelong commitment...and yes, gays are trying to change the definition of marriage. Marriage is by definition between a man and a woman, and the only way gays can marry is if they change the definition. I'm POSITIVE marriage has been around for longer than racial oppression, because marriage started in the Paleolithic era. At that time, people would be ecstatic just to run into somebody else. If by miracle the person they run into was a different race they would care, if one spent the last 6 months without talking to anybody but their small hunting group, they wouldn't waste any opportunities to meet new people. Yes, society CAN collapse overnight, because the family is the foundation of society. Messing with the foundation, unless done very carefully, can drop whole building on your head. Yes, heterosexual marriage IS under attack. Gays are trying to take the privilege they earned by being the dominant means of reproduction in our society. And, yes, any PERMANENT installment of gay marriage will require people to be shot. Marriage affects common people on a day to day level. By comparison government can affect people, but not every day. If one of Australia's generals went crazy, turned traitor, and pulled a coup de tat making himsef Emperor of Australia, there would be a lot of people who would fight to reinstall democracy. Government affects people enough that they would be willing to die for it, and marriage and family affects people more than government. Logic would assume that people would be even more prone to fight for family than for government.
Dr Brain Posted February 28, 2005 Report Posted February 28, 2005 Gays are trying to take the privilege they earned by being the dominant means of reproduction in our society. You mean people are trying to take it in the name of gays
Zeke Posted February 28, 2005 Report Posted February 28, 2005 Lets do a cost benefit analysis: What do Gays gain? Tax breaks. What does civilization lose? Another barrier between children and a total lack of morality.<{POST_SNAPBACK}> Spoken like a true politician. Why don't we continue to say to our kids, "Those people are different than us, so they shouldn't be allowed to be happy. They believe in things that we don't, and that's a bad thing." People are killed because they live and think differently than others, even if said thinking doesn't hurt anyone else. College kids being killed for coming out of the closet, parents killed because they have bi-racial kids... and the Pres does his part in compounding throw back thinking, just so he looks good. There's more than enough money floating around if the government knew how to budget properly, tax cuts/breaks wouldn't be that big of deal. Marriage isn't just about tax breaks, it's a spiritual and outward expression of how you feel about someone else, be it recognized by the state or not. I feel that it's a shot to people who want to express themselves freely in that manner... this is a way for the government to say, "You're not allowed to be recognized as normal." One thing I always respected in the States was the "Persuit of happiness." As such, it's being cut again by people with religious intent to cover their own !@#$%^&*es. Why don't we go back to enforcing anti-sodomy laws between heterosexuals? - Z P.S. You can screw your "lack of morality." If those ideas are morally correct, than we're all screwed. There's more to society than numbers and dollar figures.
Aileron Posted February 28, 2005 Report Posted February 28, 2005 That's another gay sex arguement that does not justify gay marriage.
Dr Brain Posted February 28, 2005 Report Posted February 28, 2005 Agreed. I have no problem with gay sex beyond what I have with straight sex. The gay marriage question doesn't really involve gay sex.
MonteZuma Posted February 28, 2005 Report Posted February 28, 2005 I've never said it will cause economic collapse.Actually you did. To point out the bleeding obvious, when I asked how European society was collapsing, you replied: Europe is dying. ... The European economy has been slowing down. France and Germany are starting to fall off the world stage. Anyway...If you have any examples as to how Europe is collapsing socially, please give us some. Social, quite possibly, but not economic.How? Will it lead to more unwanted pregnancies? Will fathers desert their wife and children and run off with another man? Will women stop having babies? Will kids at school be teased because they their parents are heterosexual? How will anything change if you allow same sex unions? And don't ask how I linked Europe to same sex marriage. YOU DID THAT.Many European countries permit same sex marriage or union. If anyone thinks that society will collapse because of it, then why not look at Europe?
MonteZuma Posted February 28, 2005 Report Posted February 28, 2005 Marriage is by definition between a man and a woman, and the only way gays can marry is if they change the definition.I guess that depends which dictionary you use. The dictionary on my computer gives 4 definitions and none exclude same sex unions. Marriage: 1. The state of being a married couple voluntarily joined for life (or until divorce) 2. Two people who are married to each other 3. The act of marrying; the nuptial ceremony 4. A close and intimate union In any case, I think a perfect compromise would be to have marriage (for m/f relationships) and civil unions (for m/m or f/f relationships). The only difference between the two would be the name. Maybe that would prevent society from collapsing? I'm POSITIVE marriage has been around for longer than racial oppression, because marriage started in the Paleolithic era.Maybe, but I suspect that homo erectus were beating each other up because one tribe looked different, or because they behaved differently or because they came from somewhere else or because they had garlic breath long before the idea of marriage was ever invented. Yes, society CAN collapse overnight, because the family is the foundation of society. Messing with the foundation, unless done very carefully, can drop whole building on your head.The family is not under attack. Yes, heterosexual marriage IS under attack. Gays are trying to take the privilege they earned by being the dominant means of reproduction in our society.I don't see any evidence that gays want to be the dominant means of reproduction (whatever that means?). Most gays I've met aren't interested in having kids. And, yes, any PERMANENT installment of gay marriage will require people to be shot. Marriage affects common people on a day to day level. By comparison government can affect people, but not every day.But nobody got shot in Europe? If Billy and Bobby want to get married, it won't affect my life one little bit. But it might make them a bit happier. Let them do it. If one of Australia's generals went crazy, turned traitor, and pulled a coup de tat making himsef Emperor of Australia, there would be a lot of people who would fight to reinstall democracy.I think you are stretching the imagination by comparing this to same sex marriage Government affects people enough that they would be willing to die for it, and marriage and family affects people more than government. Logic would assume that people would be even more prone to fight for family than for government.Life still goes on in Vermont. The government hasn't been overthrown. Lambs frolic in the fields, moms and dads take their kids to play in the park, and Billy and Bobby can have a civil union and get all the benefits !@#$%^&*ociated with marriage.
Phyran Posted March 3, 2005 Report Posted March 3, 2005 There has been as many gay marriages "protests" as there are divorces among gays, it shows they don't have commitment. Lets go back to the why marry part?Marriage is to reaffirm one's love with another everlasting + financial benefits + rearing a child (optional)
Vile Requiem Posted March 4, 2005 Report Posted March 4, 2005 Divorce is not a valid argument against anything, the rate in the US is 50%. 1 in 2 hetrosexuals break up their marriages.
Phyran Posted March 4, 2005 Report Posted March 4, 2005 Divorce is not a valid argument against anything, the rate in the US is 50%. 1 in 2 hetrosexuals break up their marriages.<{POST_SNAPBACK}> What i mean is that a lot of those couples in gay marriages that happened as a protest broke up pretty quickly, they werent serious enough
Dav Posted March 4, 2005 Report Posted March 4, 2005 trhat was just a protest, still doesnt justify a reason to ban it.
MasterDrake Posted March 6, 2005 Report Posted March 6, 2005 Your all gay so stfu problem solved I'm so helpful, NOW GO PROTEST !
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