Paine Posted October 28, 2004 Report Posted October 28, 2004 As you have probably heard, Y!@#$%^&*er Arafat was advised to leave his compound in Isreal after his condition has seriously deteriorated. However there are many p[roblems with this, mainly because of the strong possibility that he will be blocked from returning to the country, and also who will take charge if he leaves? I have no real strong opinion on this matter, but I would like t hear your opinions on this matter.
Aileron Posted October 28, 2004 Report Posted October 28, 2004 This is not as important as you think it is. If Arafat's health is that bad, he isn't an effective leader anyway.
MonteZuma Posted October 29, 2004 Report Posted October 29, 2004 This is big news. If he dies - or becomes too ill to function - this will be a turning point in the Arab-Israeli conflict. Only time will tell what direction it will take.
MasterDrake Posted October 29, 2004 Report Posted October 29, 2004 maybe a new leader can open relations with isreal? is that what your saying monte cause that would be great for once
MonteZuma Posted October 29, 2004 Report Posted October 29, 2004 Yep. Maybe. Who knows what will happen.
Aileron Posted October 29, 2004 Report Posted October 29, 2004 I don't think Arafat was calling the show anyway...sadly, we have to root for him dying. As soon as he is out of the way, the person who is actually calling the shots might step foward as official leader, and real negotiations will start. Its unlikely that such a leader even exists, or would step foward in official capacity if he did, but I'm still hoping.
Yupa Posted October 30, 2004 Report Posted October 30, 2004 Arafat is a dumb!@#$%^&*. The only reason anybody cares is because if he croaks, they'll probably be some blood before a new leader emerges.
Manus Celer Dei Posted October 31, 2004 Report Posted October 31, 2004 Arafat is a dumb!@#$%^&*. The only reason anybody cares is because if he croaks, they'll probably be some blood before a new leader emerges.<{POST_SNAPBACK}> And probably after the new leader emerges too. It seems to be the century of the hardliner.
Dav Posted October 31, 2004 Report Posted October 31, 2004 Arafat wasnt calling the show, he tried to in the past but a lack of resolution caused HAMAS to act indipendantly of the PLO and they pretty much dont listen. If arafat dies a new leader will be needed, this leader will have to be remarkable if the peace effort is to move foward. Somone that can unite the palistininas into a non-violant approach to peace is going to be unlikly, especially with sharon in israili power.
Yupa Posted October 31, 2004 Report Posted October 31, 2004 this leader will have to be remarkable if the peace effort is to move fowardI'd hardly call someone devoted to peace instead of wanting to blow !@#$%^&* up remarkable, but you may be right, there may be no people like that in Israel or Palestine.
Aileron Posted November 1, 2004 Report Posted November 1, 2004 Well, you got the idea of cultural evolution...if all the violent Palestinians blow themselves up before reproducing...all that's left are the peacefull ones. Even if the Hamas leader takes control its an improvement. At least Israel would be talking to the person who calls the shots.
Dav Posted November 1, 2004 Report Posted November 1, 2004 They may bre talking to somone that calls the shots but the problem is that neither side will be willing to comprimise in this situation. The only way i see a resolution to this is if Hamas seice fire, the view of palistinians becomes more favorable and sharon is voted against as a result in favor of a leader willing to comprimse. Chances of this happening are slim but it will be essiential that the new leader should there be one can gain unites support from the palistinians.
MonteZuma Posted November 1, 2004 Report Posted November 1, 2004 Well, you got the idea of cultural evolution...if all the violent Palestinians blow themselves up before reproducing...all that's left are the peacefull ones.If you believe that Palestininian violence is genetic then you are either racist or ignorant or both. It's learned behaviour. Part cultural and part inspired by events in recent history and living memory. Even if the Hamas leader takes control its an improvement. At least Israel would be talking to the person who calls the shots.That would be like negotiating with Al Qaeda. Hamas don't call the shots for the average Palestinian, although they might be responsible for much of the violence. Negotiating with Hamas is dumb. Hamas will lose respect and lose members when Israel wins the hearts and minds of ordinary Palestinians. That won't happen whilst Israel persists with her own violent campaign of control and repression. Negotiate with Hamas??? Pfffft
Dav Posted November 1, 2004 Report Posted November 1, 2004 thje only way to put an end to hamas is for the young people who feel they must die for their cause to see that there is another way, if they cant recruit anyone thay will be no more.
MasterDrake Posted November 2, 2004 Report Posted November 2, 2004 so basically start a hippie brigade just what we !@#$%^&*ing need
»Ducky Posted November 2, 2004 Report Posted November 2, 2004 If you believe that Palestininian violence is genetic then you are either racist or ignorant or both. It's learned behaviour. Part cultural and part inspired by events in recent history and living memory.You misread his statement. Without reproduced children, there is no one new to "learn" those acts of violence. It was said without any conclusion involving genetics.
MonteZuma Posted November 2, 2004 Report Posted November 2, 2004 If you believe that Palestininian violence is genetic then you are either racist or ignorant or both. It's learned behaviour. Part cultural and part inspired by events in recent history and living memory.You misread his statement. Without reproduced children, there is no one new to "learn" those acts of violence. It was said without any conclusion involving genetics.<{POST_SNAPBACK}>Either way, a lot of suicide bombers come from non-violent families. Suicide bombers won't die out.
Aileron Posted November 2, 2004 Report Posted November 2, 2004 Well, I said CULTURAL evolution...ur thinking of Ethnical evolution, which is an entirely different thing. My point was even if a Hamas leader takes controll and Israeli/Palestinian talks go nowhere, it still is an improvement, because the talks will accurately represent the stage in the conflict. If Hamas doesn't want to negotiate, then Hamas doesn't want to negotiate and their representative should reflect that. Then the Israelis wouldn't sign their half of a treaty in the first place, and would be able to focus on truly bringing Hamas to the table.
MonteZuma Posted November 3, 2004 Report Posted November 3, 2004 Then the Israelis wouldn't sign their half of a treaty in the first place, and would be able to focus on truly bringing Hamas to the table.<{POST_SNAPBACK}>Inviting Hamas to the table would be like inviting Osama to the table.
Aileron Posted November 3, 2004 Report Posted November 3, 2004 Still more effective than negotiating with a leadership that isn't in charge. Its better to be going very slowly in real progress than it is to make great strides with false leaders.
MonteZuma Posted November 3, 2004 Report Posted November 3, 2004 Why not invite Osama in for a nice chat and a cup of tea too?
Aileron Posted November 4, 2004 Report Posted November 4, 2004 Well, my point is that the US would make more progress nego-*BAD WORD*-ing with Bin Laden than say Michale Moore speaking for Al Queda. We could make all the progress with Moore we want, but not only would it change nothing, but we would be wasting our time and resources. Its better to go nowhere with a person calling the shots than to make progress with someone who isn't.
makavelilikepac Posted November 11, 2004 Report Posted November 11, 2004 Well arafat is dead now lets see what happenes palistine is will crazy on isreal lol
madhaha Posted December 2, 2004 Report Posted December 2, 2004 Gah. No-one knows whats going to happen. Can the bull!@#$%^&*ting please stop.
Dr Brain Posted December 2, 2004 Report Posted December 2, 2004 Gah. No-one knows whats going to happen. Can the bull!@#$%^&*ting please stop.<{POST_SNAPBACK}>Let me be the first to say that it stopped something like three weeks ago. You bumped a dead topic and told it to STFU. Yes, that *does* make you look intelligent.
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