Maher Arar

[Dr.Worthless]

Oddly, the Canadians question US decisions to oust suspected terrorists yet sadly, they have never felt the cold wind of terrorism in their country. Does it take a terrorist to dive bomb a bloated 747 into Montreal or Calgary before you understand?

 

Actually they have. I wasn't alive during the time however (I think). I think they had a bout of bombings in the 70's (???) Monte chime in, im sure you know the dates.

[A Soldier]

Oddly, the Canadians question US decisions to oust suspected terrorists yet sadly, they have never felt the cold wind of terrorism in their country. Does it take a terrorist to dive bomb a bloated 747 into Montreal or Calgary before you understand?

 

Actually they have. I wasn't alive during the time however (I think). I think they had a bout of bombings in the 70's (???) Monte chime in, im sure you know the dates.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I think you are refering to the FLQ (Front de libération du Québec), a terrorist organisation who kidnapped a diplomat and a minister because they wanted Quebec to obtain independance from Canada.

 

What I don't get though is Rec's comment. Understand what? Did you ever ask yourself why Canada never (as far as I'm concerned) got threatened by foreign terrorist organisations?

[Guest Recombo]

Heh, some things about 'peaceful' Canada:

 

1. Canada was one of the founding members of NATO.

2. Canada demanded rights for US nuclear empowerment.

3. Canada was closely involved in the Gulf War

4. KOSOVO.

5. Cambodia, Croatia, Bosnia, and Somalia

 

Canada has been in every peacekeeping effort that the US has, and has equally killed and bombed in defense of its own agenda.

 

You were saying....?

[Vile Requiem]

(wow, i'm helping recombo out)

 

The US also friendly-fire killed a few Canadians in Afganistan too fyi.

[Guest Recombo]

Friendly fire is an unfortunate part of war. It happens to every nation in every war known to man. There's nothing to your point other than an attempt to make it appear that the US wants to actively kill Canadians. Great opinion there. Didn't you know they're out to get you?

[Vile Requiem]

Grow up and learn some context.

 

I was pointing out that Canadians were in Afganistan too

[A Soldier]

Heh, some things about 'peaceful' Canada:

 

1.  Canada was one of the founding members of NATO.

2.  Canada demanded rights for US nuclear empowerment.

3.  Canada was closely involved in the Gulf War

4.  KOSOVO.

5.  Cambodia, Croatia, Bosnia, and Somalia

 

Canada has been in every peacekeeping effort that the US has, and has equally killed and bombed in defense of its own agenda.

 

You were saying....?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Uh...

1. Taken from NATO's FAQ:

Q: What does NATO do?

A: The North Atlantic Treaty Organisation (NATO) is an alliance of 26 countries from North America and Europe committed to fulfilling the goals of the North Atlantic Treaty signed on 4 April 1949. In accordance with the Treaty, the fundamental role of NATO is to safeguard the freedom and security of its member countries by political and military means. NATO is playing an increasingly important role in crisis management and peacekeeping

I don't even see why you mentionned NATO... :/

 

2. ..?

 

3. Was there not a resolution proposed and accepted by the security council for Gulf War? Isn't Canada a member of the UN? ...

 

4.

Canada called this "Operation Kinetic' date='" committing at least 1,300 soldiers to the KFOR peacekeeping operation based in the Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia.

 

[...']

 

The main goal of the peacekeeping force was to ensure the safe return of 850,000 refugees who fled Kosovo since March, 1999, and the estimated 500,000 internally displaced people.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/background/cdnmilitary/kosovo.html

Canada to Contribute $5.6 Million for Health Projects in Kosovo

 

(2000-29) News Release

May 23' date=' 2000

 

Pristina, Kosovo — Maria Minna, Canada's Minister for International Cooperation, today announced that Canada will contribute $5.6 million for health-related projects in Kosovo. She made the announcement during her two-day visit in the region.[/quote']

http://www.acdi-cida.gc.ca/cida_ind.nsf/0/...0f?OpenDo-*BAD WORD*-ent

 

5.

Canada and Japan Working Together in the Fight Against Terrorism

 

Canada's peace and security cooperation with Japan took an important step forward in March 2003 as Japanese Maritime Self Defence Force ships began re-fuelling Canadian naval vessels engaged in the fight against terrorism in Operation Enduring Freedom.

 

While Canada's relationship with Japan has traditionally been based on economic and commercial interests, Japan's increasing engagement in international security provides numerous opportunities for partnerships with Canada.

 

Opportunities for expanding Canada-Japan security and defence cooperation exist in the areas of counter-terrorism, human security, peace support operations, non-proliferation, arms control and disarmament.

 

[...]Cambodia and Canada Achieve Significant Landmine Success

 

The Cambodia National Level One Survey, which took place from 2000 to 2002, was a joint project between the Canadian International Development Agency (CIDA) and the Cambodian Mine Action Centre (CMAC). The $2 million dollar landmine survey was carried out by the Canadian executing agency Geospatial International Inc., and involved training and sending survey teams to all but two of the 13,910 villages in Cambodia.

http://www.dfait-maeci.gc.ca/asia/country/...05-01-03-en.asp

 

Do you need more links?

 

Now, I will ask you the same question again: ever wondered why Canada is never threatened (as far as I'm concerned) by foreign terrorist organisations..?

 

Canada has been in every peacekeeping effort that the US has' date=' [b']and has equally killed and bombed in defense of its own agenda.[/b]

Ridiculous statement.

[Aileron]

*falls of his chair*

 

OMG! We are actually paying attention to the wrongs of other countries for once!

 

Monte, I wouldn't classify terrorists as human. To some extent, I don't see how someone could plan the killing of innocent children, lable it a "Jihad" (meaning that combatants should only kill other combatants, and let the charitable actions of the clergy be the means of changing your oponants opinion) and still keep his human rights in the end. Maybe not in every case, but certainly in some. I'd rather enfringe on the liberties of terrorists than infringe on those of the innocent public with tighter security measures.

 

 

Canada does wish to sidestep the war on terror, but unfortunately for them, its allied with the US, as well as economically tied to her. Thus, while you don't really care about the issue, you wish the US to win this fight because are tied to the US.

 

This is actually very healthy politics; there's nothing wrong here, though I wouldn't classify Canada as being heroic.

[Guest Recombo]

Anyone could post links but it won't change history. Canada as a whole was equally responsible for death and destruction as any other country does when they are put to the test. I'm not sure what your claim is A Soldier because there is really no merit in trying to hide history.

[A Soldier]

Anyone could post links but it won't change history.  Canada as a whole was equally responsible for death and destruction as any other country does when they are put to the test.  I'm not sure what your claim is A Soldier because there is really no merit in trying to hide history.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

And I am not sure what you are trying to prove... Canada is a peaceful country, renowned for it's diplomacy, peacekeeping efforts and the aid it provides for countries in the need of it. I'm pretty sure we can both agree on that.

 

Now, you claim it has blood on its hand because we were involved in Kosovo, Cambodia, etc., you name it by sending troops to keep peace and order and giving humanitarian aid?

 

I don't see how I am hiding history. Perhaps you could enlighten me?

[Guest Recombo]

Take more time to look into what your country does. You seem to be so quick to judge the USA, but you don't even have a clue what your own country does. Canada sends humanitarian aid, yes, as does the USA. If we go there, we will unquestionably find that the US gives at a 1,000:1 ratio of Canada.

 

Keeping peace and order is done through military might. You just cannot make a claim that your country wasn't attacked because it's 'peaceful. That is so far from the cold truth.

 

Your argument is invalid. Mexico has a better chance at this claim than Canada.

 

I am not going to post links because it would waste my time. Do your research. You will see.

[A Soldier]

Take more time to look into what your country does.  You seem to be so quick to judge the USA, but you don't even have a clue what your own country does.  Canada sends humanitarian aid, yes, as does the USA.  If we go there, we will unquestionably find that the US gives at a 1,000:1 ratio of Canada.

I never said the US don't send aid.

In terms of economic aid per GDP, Canada donates more though. Your ratio is bull.

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph-T/eco_eco_aid_don_gdp

 

Again, I seem to know so little about my country. So why don't you help me out and tell me what's wrong with it?

 

Keeping peace and order is done through military might.  You just cannot make a claim that your country wasn't attacked because it's 'peaceful.  That is so far from the cold truth.

.....??? Well, at least, being peaceful sure does help eh?

So what else prevents my country from being attacked?

 

I am not going to post links because it would waste my time.  Do your research.  You will see.

I've posted links to prove my points, it's your turn now. If you have time to post on a forum, you certainly must have some left to give me credible arguments. Why don't you start by showing me that [Compared to the US, Canada] has equally killed and bombed in defense of its own agenda.

[Guest Recombo]

Son, denial is not only ignorance, but also arrogant. As I've said, I'm not your history teacher. You can sit there in denial regardless of the facts but it doesn't change history. I like your GDP twist on humanitarian aid. Great twist. Factor remains overwhelmingly different in terms of dollars. Other countries don't care about what you can give - they care about what they are getting.

 

Now that we're off subject - let's return. Tell us one more time, why you think Canada remains free from terrorism?

[A Soldier]

Such a predictable answer. Thanks for giving me the last word.

Now that we're off subject - let's return. Tell us one more time' date=' why you think Canada remains free from terrorism?[/quote']

Heh. I asked you first

[Aileron]

Canada remains free from terrorism because terroirsts can hurt Canada more by attacking the US.

 

Recombo's general point is valid. When a citizen from the US feels like helping the poor, he or she pays out of their own pocket. When a Canadian does, they selfishly try to preserve their pockets and just point their finger at the US and try to guilt trip us into being more charitable.

 

That, my friends is why I hate all forms of liberalism, socialism, and communism. All three systems are people who want to force people richer than themselves to help the poor, because they are too selfish to do so themselves.

[A Soldier]

OH PLEASE!

 

Canada remains free from terrorism because terroirsts can hurt Canada more by attacking the US.

And what the -*BAD WORD*- did Canada do to deserve that uh?

 

When a citizen from the US feels like helping the poor, he or she pays out of their own pocket. When a Canadian does, they selfishly try to preserve their pockets and just point their finger at the US and try to guilt trip us into being more charitable.

?????????????

So the website that shows Canada donates a good portion of it's GDP is an illusion? Come on aileron, you know better than that.

 

The point is, you can't compare in terms of money since we don't have the same economy, unless you like comparing oranges with bananas.

[MonteZuma]

I think they had a bout of bombings in the 70's (???)  Monte chime in, im sure you know the dates.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Its late and I'm tired

 

Interesting article:

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/series/reme.../20010928a.html

[MonteZuma]

Monte, I wouldn't classify terrorists as human.  To some extent, I don't see how someone could plan the killing of innocent children, lable it a "Jihad" (meaning that combatants should only kill other combatants, and let the charitable actions of the clergy be the means of changing your oponants opinion) and still keep his human rights in the end.  Maybe not in every case, but certainly in some.  I'd rather enfringe on the liberties of terrorists than infringe on those of the innocent public with tighter security measures.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

This Canadian dude isn't a terrorist. If we deny any individual their basic human rights then we are no better than the terrorists themselves. If we (the west) want the moral high-ground then we should not lower ourselves to the standards of terrorists.

[Dr.Worthless]

Mr. Trudeau sounds like my kinda man. Why cant canada re-elect someone cut from his mold.

[mr. scruff]

You say terrorists should be allowed to be tortured, but has it ever occured to you that someone will admit to anything when their eye balls are being burned out, their fingers broken? Torture doesn't work, in the middle ages people admited to witch craft because otherwise they would be killed, and in some cases tortured, but they were not witchs. Torture is a very primative and pointless way of extracting information.

 

The reason america gets bombed is because they suport the terrorist state of isreal, they meddle in the afairs of other countries, they try to impose their idea of freedom on the world. I laugh when people call America the land of the free. Thats bull -*BAD WORD*-. For instance, Iraq, before you invaded them, they were not a threat, and probably very few people harboured anti-american sentiments, but now that you have invaded and occupied Iraq, and instated a puppet goverment, I'm sure there are a lot of future terrorists. You have to learn that these terrorists are the fault of america's foriegn policy. No other country gets attacked like you do, and you respond with war. You people are -*BAD WORD*-ing idiots if you think america is solving any of its problems.

[Aileron]

I'm well aware as to why torture was halted. The thing is that it only applies to when it is used to generate a rationalized confession. However, what we are looking for is reasoned information about other terrorists actions. Basically, the witch hunters used torture to "prove" the person was a witch. We have terrorists who are already proven to be terrorists, and we want other information out of them. That other information can still be fabricated, but its better we have too much information with some of it being factual rather than have no information.

 

 

It also doesn't violate humanitarian standards. These people's fate was decided by their actions. No one forced them to join an organization that' sole purpose is slaughtering of civilians, and the prospect of saving the next batch of a hundred or so civilians outweighs the suffering of the one or two people who probably had it coming anyway.

 

 

It shouldn't be automatically used in every case, only a few select cases with some of the more high-ranking individuals. All I'm saying is that it shouldn't be automatically ruled out. I'd rather have a few terrorist leaders suffer than have another Patriot Act or another September 11th.

[Dr.Worthless]

You have to learn that these terrorists are the fault of america's foriegn policy. No other country gets attacked like you do

hhmm, I'm sure the citizens of Ireland would have alittle something to say about this if asked..

 

You people are -*BAD WORD*-ing idiots if you think america is solving any of its problems.

 

Ah, another america hater, welcome to the forums. Please follow the path to the left and join the other 99% of folks that talk on here.

[Bacchus]

Ireland terrorism is more akin to a civil war then to foreign terrorism.

 

USA interests are attacked by foreign agents...but since even that won't ring a bell, i suppose nothing will.

 

 

Just so you know regarding USA "aid" to other countries:

 

USA ambargo"ed" so much (like Cuba, Vietnam, Haiti also if i'm not mistaken..though it might be a bit out of my -*BAD WORD*-) that it practically killed more people from starvation, disease and other poverty "effects" that USA embargos could almost be compared to WMD's.

 

USA "generously" gave 60 000$ US to Haiti, which is sinking right now. What Canada did? Well, i'm not much of a Canadian, but Canada sent 2 millions right away, no question asked. Quebec'S Gov alone sent 200 000$, Quebec's citizen are sending so much food, clothes, and money we don'T know how to bring it there.

 

 

So on the "peace" game, you sucks.

[Dr.Worthless]

USA "generously" gave 60 000$ US to Haiti, which is sinking right now. What Canada did? Well, i'm not much of a Canadian, but Canada sent 2 millions right away, no question asked. Quebec'S Gov alone sent 200 000$, Quebec's citizen are sending so much food, clothes, and money we don'T know how to bring it there.

 

Yep, everyone knows that the US are just -*BAD WORD*-s that dont contribute to the world community at all.. us -*BAD WORD*-s. Its not like from 45-86 the US has given out 257 BILLION dollars in aid to the world or anything..

 

Source

 

Seriously, do you guys just speak from your -*BAD WORD*- or what?

[Bacchus]

come on...

 

 

60 000$ US

 

 

i could probably get a bigger loan for christ sake...