I've been banned?

[cash flow king]

Legacy... Are you comparing a repel in a subspace match to a murder? Not sure I see the comparison, but you can not "premeditate" to repel someone... 

 

I do respect the fact that you also agree that a 90 day ban for what is ALLEGED to have occurred is still excessive. I am still waiting to hear from a single person that they agree that the ALLEGED crime fits the punishment. 

[Ozn]

"From what I have read and heard, Ozn repeled after respawning and attempted to alter the course of the game. in THAT aspect(especially given it was a playoff game), the intent to disrupt the game was present and based on that INTENT, the accused should be punished...to what extent i am not sure. But to allow this to happen without punishment will only promote others to do lame shit in future games for an unfair advantage. It has nothing to do with whether the repel had an effect on the game or not. It has everything to do with the fact that the INTENT was there. Much like murdering someone, a big part of committing a crime is decided on whether it was premeditated or not. 

 

Every person that has ever tried to 'cheat' in any one sense or another has been banned and i can think of probably a dozen different people over the years that have deservingly earned themselves a ban. the punishment for things like this are pretty straight forward, tho i personally think a ban for 90 days is a bit extreme. I think a ban in general is a bit extreme(under the circumstances), BUT if u did indeed respawn and use a repel after ur third death, that IS illegal, regardless what u think. if u think its unfair to ban u, then what would u suggest would be a more fair alternative so that others wont do this in the future?(now that its out there, theres obviously nothing to stop others from doing the same thing with no reprimand enforced)....

 

Legacy

 

From what you've heard...from Caerbannog.

 

There was no attempt to alter the game. I had ONE FUCKING SECOND to react to some bullshit glitch in this game and my first knee-jerk reaction was to repel. When faced with ONE SECOND how would you react to something you've never seen before? You're acting as if I had all this time to sit there and weigh the pros and cons my situation. Jesus christ.

 

The fact that a discussion about me being punished, how long I should be banned for - or that I was"altering" the game is even being mentioned is still completely asinine. I said I wasn't going to respond anymore but I still can't believe these discussion points are still being identified and mulled over.

 

Caerbannog logged on the forums yesterday and responded to a thread about a BUNNY instead of handling this. By virtue of that it's clear to me this is personal and he is biased. You don't ban someone without informing them and the league - then pussyfoot around and rub it in someone's face by posting in a worthless topic. He knows what's going on and he's loving it.

[Marioman]

Now, from the perspective of our game this past weekend, NO i did not see what happened because after i died, all i was thinking about was bitching crescendo out for TKing me. 

Haha. That bomb probably wouldn't have tk'd you if he repped before he died.

 

Anyway, unless I'm wrong, the glitch where a player lives on their local client but the server calculates a death has been experienced by a multitude of players (myself included). I don't think it's possible to claim that's what happened here because there's no way he could've lived the damage that was dealt in that situation.

[Ozn]

 

Now, from the perspective of our game this past weekend, NO i did not see what happened because after i died, all i was thinking about was bitching crescendo out for TKing me. 

Haha. That bomb probably wouldn't have tk'd you if he repped before he died.

 

Anyway, unless I'm wrong, the glitch where a player lives on their local client but the server calculates a death has been experienced by a multitude of players (myself included). I don't think it's possible to claim that's what happened here because there's no way he could've lived the damage that was dealt in that situation.

 

 

Yep, you're wrong in this instance.

 

As you said - it's a glitch that's occurred before. However, I don't think you can confidently claim that every damage packet I (and Legacy) received and sent was accounted for. Actually, you can't say that about anybody because nobody has a perfect connection. So to state that there's no way I could have lived is a theory and not a fact.

 

Your opinion of how much damage was taken is hugely flawed anyway - because you were connecting from Turkey on Sunday.

 

I'm still waiting for an Outlaws player to speak in a manner that's truly neutral and not rooted in a desire to see me get banned for something that didn't happen. Everyone else seems to get it and doesn't automatically assume that I tried to do something malicious.

Edited July 16, 2014 by Ozn

[Marioman]

After a lengthy discussion and speculation on the events that occurred, the players on our squadron involved in the match (Ozn, 7th, Inertia, Devious), have agreed on what we believe happened.

Ozn and Legacy engaged each other which ultimately led in a double KO. When this occurred Legacy's ship disappeared as normal and respawned somewhere on the map outside of where we were fighting and he was sent to spec. However, Ozn's ship never respawned normally in a random location of the map.  After the double KO, OZN due to a known but rare glitch in the game, respawned in the same exact spot he died.  During the frenzy of battle this glitch respawn is usually not realized immediately because it is not normal.  At that point he killed legacy out, he died out but never respawned normally, instead the glitch kept him in the same spot he died and he immediately repelled thinking he never died.

 

Actually Ozn I was just trying to understand what happened so i can have a more informed opinion about the validity (or invalidity -- i'm not biased, this is ridiculous) of your ban. You'd have to drop the bomb that was shot to have any chance at living, and ploss/dropping damage occurs at a very minimal rate... so i can definitely say with confidence there's no way you should've lived there. (Nacre has a replay on his twitch account, mindriot linked it here) 

 

If you died on your client then there's a respawn timer where you can't do anything... if you didn't then the above makes more sense.

[#TWMASTERZONE]

There is a known glitch in the game where you don't respawn, your ship just continues on at the same place you died recharging from 0 energy. It's very understandable Ozn hit the repel button when he saw his energy at double digits in the heat of the moment. 

[7th Saga]

7th here, Speaking as a former Outlaws/FTN/nguyen player for 6+ years? and their previous council member, currently CM's Council member.  I am here to say that Outlaws and CM don't want OZN banned.  I believe this solely lies on Caerbannog.  I have been playing this game for quite a few years... and have never seen anything of this capacity before (in a league match).  I try to be a friend to all (excluding Dre and Pez) and caer has been a friend, even though a lot of people hate him.  I think that his mind has been clouded on this issue and should elicit some type of response from him other than a personal message saying that "He broke a rule."  and nothing else being said.  

 

From my personal experience in this glitch, I have had this happen a number of times.  I have double died almost a half dozen times (it’s never happened to me Last Life) and each time I basically continued to live or respawn (whatever actually happens) with 0 energy and the same items from before.  Each time I was pissed because I looked down and the bot said I died and I was still alive (or so I thought) and then since I had 0 nrg I died a second time for two deaths in a matter of seconds.  Each time I “died, but lived”, I did not know I died, for a few seconds.  If you compare this to OZN's situation, I am not totally sure on what happened as for I didn't see it and it's all second hand, but I can understand that if you were in a situation of this nature in a semi-final game where it looks like you lived and had 0 nrg with the same items (a repel as one of them) under that duress, would you not repel? 

 

So, the question is, why would someone be thrown the book at when it was fairly clear to over 95% of the population that it was not malicious.  As Motorzep said, with over 40+ people watching, wouldn't someone have said something?  No, no one said anything because there was nothing.  Why are we penalizing someone for a glitch in the game?  If this is how we are going to treat our population, then I really don’t want anything to do with this zone anymore. 

 

7^th – 5 time pro chump

Edited July 16, 2014 by 7th Saga

[Marioman]

I'm in agreement with what 7th said about double deaths and with regards to the ban but I think there should be some discussion on the story so it can be accepted without doubt.

Personally, I would be totally fine with that rationalization of what happened if it looked like he could have narrowly escaped death in that situation.
The second part is, if that happened, would people see the rep? I know when i've had the double death (not on LL) i have been able to shoot and other people have seen my bullets being shot from an invisible ship after. Again, just discussion.

[Ozn]

I'm in agreement with what 7th said about double deaths and with regards to the ban but I think there should be some discussion on the story so it can be accepted without doubt.

 

Personally, I would be totally fine with that rationalization of what happened if it looked like he could have narrowly escaped death in that situation.

The second part is, if that happened, would people see the rep? I know when i've had the double death (not on LL) i have been able to shoot and other people have seen my bullets being shot from an invisible ship after. Again, just discussion.

 

When my ship was floating there with 0 energy I had a random spread of bullets near me left over from the fight. The rest of the team had cleared off the screen and I tried to repel the bullets away from me to escape and i was instantly spec'd right after that. I'm on a 27" with 2560x1440 and size small font so I don't have massive kill messages in my face. All I had was a second to react to what happened - which has never happened to me before.

[Three]

"From what ive gathered not a single person other than Caerbannog can claim they saw me attach (out of an arena of 50) to repel or whatever. Legacy even chimed in and said he didn't see what happened but still wants to see me get banned too. His reasons are quite clouded because the only comments he would give revolved around him getting banned for something, him thinking i suck and that we got a fluke win. Sound logic."

 

(excuse the typos, punctuation, capitalization, i really dont care to fix right now)

 

Whoever told u what i said could have at least kept from butchering it up so badly as to make it sound like i am in favor of caers decision just because we are squadmates. let me reiterate on that...

 

Yes caer and me and squadmates. so what? just because we are on the same team doesnt mean we see things eye to eye. infact, caer banned me last season(his own squadmate) for subbing in on a practice i just had died out in because our team was in need of a player. i was banned for 1.5 weeks and missed the next game(which we also lost in my absence and thus effected our standings for the remainder of the season). banned for a practice? was my intent meant to fuck the practice up? much like what Ozn claims, obviously not...my intent was to keep the practice fair and balanced for the remainder of the game. if u ask me, that was a joke to ban me but whatever. but to anyone pointing fingers saying caerbannog is biased and wants Outlaws to win, gimme a break...count how many times weve had to make comebacks over the past few seasons and earned whatever we had come out way. the last thing anyone on outlaws wants is a free ride to the finals.

 

Now, from the perspective of our game this past weekend, NO i did not see what happened because after i died, all i was thinking about was bitching crescendo out for TKing me. From what I have read and heard, Ozn repeled after respawning and attempted to alter the course of the game. in THAT aspect(especially given it was a playoff game), the intent to disrupt the game was present and based on that INTENT, the accused should be punished...to what extent i am not sure. But to allow this to happen without punishment will only promote others to do lame shit in future games for an unfair advantage. It has nothing to do with whether the repel had an effect on the game or not. It has everything to do with the fact that the INTENT was there. Much like murdering someone, a big part of committing a crime is decided on whether it was premeditated or not. 

 

In all my years of playing this game, i cant say ive ever had a death where i had absolutely no clue that i died and continued playing. There are plenty of warnings in-game to let someone know they died with onscreen messages, robot messages, respawns, etc. If it was caused my a glitch, then all kills caused from pblank mines and pblank thors should also be voided since they shouldnt count to begin with.

 

Personally, i dont really care whether u play this sunday or not Ozn. I dont make the decisions but i can tell u this.....whether a council is involved or not in deciding the outcome of this, any person involved will have a biased opinion because it is a playoff game and everyone wants to see the best game possible regardless of what might have occurred last sunday. I am not one to cheat, i am as fair as the next player when it comes to playing a good game. i am the first one to complain when i get killed from lame shit like pblank mines and thors and shit like that shouldnt be allowed regardless.

 

Every person that has ever tried to 'cheat' in any one sense or another has been banned and i can think of probably a dozen different people over the years that have deservingly earned themselves a ban. the punishment for things like this are pretty straight forward, tho i personally think a ban for 90 days is a bit extreme. I think a ban in general is a bit extreme(under the circumstances), BUT if u did indeed respawn and use a repel after ur third death, that IS illegal, regardless what u think. if u think its unfair to ban u, then what would u suggest would be a more fair alternative so that others wont do this in the future?(now that its out there, theres obviously nothing to stop others from doing the same thing with no reprimand enforced)....

 

Legacy

 

What intent? Ozn re-spawned, where he died, with 0 energy. I SAW IT. This is a known glitch to more than a few people - see the posts in this thread. He did not re-attach and purposely repel to disrupt the game. He defended himself from death, again. Get that through your fucking head. Nobody disputes he repelled. Again, HE DID NOT ATTACH.

 

He had 0 energy, in the semi-finals, with bullets near him. It isn't hard to comprehend.

 

Did the repel he used, at 0 energy, alter the game in any way, shape, or form? No. It had NO IMPACT. So NO IMPACT, NO INTENT.

 

There is no discussion. Those are the facts. Caerbannog has banned my squad mate for a game glitch, masking it as him "breaking a rule" so he can't continue in the post season, against the very squad Caerbannog is on. That is a conflict of interest and blatantly biased.

 

How can this league continue knowing full well how this guy reacts at the slightest QUESTION of impropriety? Where is hallucination in all of this? Where is passplay? Where is Ghost Ship? Why is this guy still in charge? A racist piece of shit that throws out racial epitaphs like they are skittles, who bans opponents best players in the playoffs because he doesn’t like them and thinks something happened, that didn’t? People wonder why this league has floundered. It’s a huge fucking hassle even to add players and remove them from rosters with this clown – any other captains have the same issue? Rhetorical question – I know you have.

 

I'm starting to think you guys (Outlaws) have energy view throughout matches, how the fuck do I know? I wouldn't put it past the sysop. Should you guys win, it will be with a huge asterisk next to it. Well done Barry Bonds.

 

Fuck all of you who honestly believe Ozn should be banned. What a joke.

[mindriot]

 

"From what ive gathered not a single person other than Caerbannog can claim they saw me attach (out of an arena of 50) to repel or whatever. Legacy even chimed in and said he didn't see what happened but still wants to see me get banned too. His reasons are quite clouded because the only comments he would give revolved around him getting banned for something, him thinking i suck and that we got a fluke win. Sound logic."

 

(excuse the typos, punctuation, capitalization, i really dont care to fix right now)

 

Whoever told u what i said could have at least kept from butchering it up so badly as to make it sound like i am in favor of caers decision just because we are squadmates. let me reiterate on that...

 

Yes caer and me and squadmates. so what? just because we are on the same team doesnt mean we see things eye to eye. infact, caer banned me last season(his own squadmate) for subbing in on a practice i just had died out in because our team was in need of a player. i was banned for 1.5 weeks and missed the next game(which we also lost in my absence and thus effected our standings for the remainder of the season). banned for a practice? was my intent meant to fuck the practice up? much like what Ozn claims, obviously not...my intent was to keep the practice fair and balanced for the remainder of the game. if u ask me, that was a joke to ban me but whatever. but to anyone pointing fingers saying caerbannog is biased and wants Outlaws to win, gimme a break...count how many times weve had to make comebacks over the past few seasons and earned whatever we had come out way. the last thing anyone on outlaws wants is a free ride to the finals.

 

Now, from the perspective of our game this past weekend, NO i did not see what happened because after i died, all i was thinking about was bitching crescendo out for TKing me. From what I have read and heard, Ozn repeled after respawning and attempted to alter the course of the game. in THAT aspect(especially given it was a playoff game), the intent to disrupt the game was present and based on that INTENT, the accused should be punished...to what extent i am not sure. But to allow this to happen without punishment will only promote others to do lame shit in future games for an unfair advantage. It has nothing to do with whether the repel had an effect on the game or not. It has everything to do with the fact that the INTENT was there. Much like murdering someone, a big part of committing a crime is decided on whether it was premeditated or not. 

 

In all my years of playing this game, i cant say ive ever had a death where i had absolutely no clue that i died and continued playing. There are plenty of warnings in-game to let someone know they died with onscreen messages, robot messages, respawns, etc. If it was caused my a glitch, then all kills caused from pblank mines and pblank thors should also be voided since they shouldnt count to begin with.

 

Personally, i dont really care whether u play this sunday or not Ozn. I dont make the decisions but i can tell u this.....whether a council is involved or not in deciding the outcome of this, any person involved will have a biased opinion because it is a playoff game and everyone wants to see the best game possible regardless of what might have occurred last sunday. I am not one to cheat, i am as fair as the next player when it comes to playing a good game. i am the first one to complain when i get killed from lame shit like pblank mines and thors and shit like that shouldnt be allowed regardless.

 

Every person that has ever tried to 'cheat' in any one sense or another has been banned and i can think of probably a dozen different people over the years that have deservingly earned themselves a ban. the punishment for things like this are pretty straight forward, tho i personally think a ban for 90 days is a bit extreme. I think a ban in general is a bit extreme(under the circumstances), BUT if u did indeed respawn and use a repel after ur third death, that IS illegal, regardless what u think. if u think its unfair to ban u, then what would u suggest would be a more fair alternative so that others wont do this in the future?(now that its out there, theres obviously nothing to stop others from doing the same thing with no reprimand enforced)....

 

Legacy

 

What intent? Ozn re-spawned, where he died, with 0 energy. I SAW IT. This is a known glitch to more than a few people - see the posts in this thread. He did not re-attach and purposely repel to disrupt the game. He defended himself from death, again. Get that through your fucking head. Nobody disputes he repelled. Again, HE DID NOT ATTACH.

 

He had 0 energy, in the semi-finals, with bullets near him. It isn't hard to comprehend.

 

Did the repel he used, at 0 energy, alter the game in any way, shape, or form? No. It had NO IMPACT. So NO IMPACT, NO INTENT.

 

There is no discussion. Those are the facts. Caerbannog has banned my squad mate for a game glitch, masking it as him "breaking a rule" so he can't continue in the post season, against the very squad Caerbannog is on. That is a conflict of interest and blatantly biased.

 

How can this league continue knowing full well how this guy reacts at the slightest QUESTION of impropriety? Where is hallucination in all of this? Where is passplay? Where is Ghost Ship? Why is this guy still in charge? A racist piece of shit that throws out racial epitaphs like they are skittles, who bans opponents best players in the playoffs because he doesn’t like them and thinks something happened, that didn’t? People wonder why this league has floundered. It’s a huge fucking hassle even to add players and remove them from rosters with this clown – any other captains have the same issue? Rhetorical question – I know you have.

 

I'm starting to think you guys (Outlaws) have energy view throughout matches, how the fuck do I know? I wouldn't put it past the sysop. Should you guys win, it will be with a huge asterisk next to it. Well done Barry Bonds.

 

Fuck all of you who honestly believe Ozn should be banned. What a joke.

 

 

Hallu has chimed in on the Pro Council Board and has the same questions we do. 

[cash flow king]

More than anything, I can't believe that Caer hasn't even had the respect or common courtesy to even address this situation 3 days in. By now obviously Caer knows his ruling has been met with anger/confusion/ etc and he hasn't even bothered to explain. 

If this isn't resolved by Friday, I think there needs to be a protest of this by everyone agreeing not to even play in this weekends playoff games. At this point, even if Caer admits to bias and agrees to modify/vacate his decision, I think there is no longer any room for him to stay in his position. Everyone has now lost confidence in any ability he has to provide fair/unbiased oversight here.

[treachen]

If this isn't resolved (and in a timely manner), I will be uninstalling this game as well.  We all put in way too much time and effort for shit like this to happen with no recourse.

 

You guys want to market and revitalize this game? You need to take care of this problem first.  I can hardly be an advocate for a game that is managed so irresponsibly.

[mindriot]

More than anything, I can't believe that Caer hasn't even had the respect or common courtesy to even address this situation 3 days in. By now obviously Caer knows his ruling has been met with anger/confusion/ etc and he hasn't even bothered to explain. 

 

If this isn't resolved by Friday, I think there needs to be a protest of this by everyone agreeing not to even play in this weekends playoff games. At this point, even if Caer admits to bias and agrees to modify/vacate his decision, I think there is no longer any room for him to stay in his position. Everyone has now lost confidence in any ability he has to provide fair/unbiased oversight here.

 

The ban should be lifted, plain and simple. Ozn should be able to play this weekend. I sincerely doubt a player of his experience is going to try and cheat. He deserves the benefit of the doubt and should not be held responsible for a game glitch. A reflex decision to defend yourself that has no outcome or impact on the game does not constitute a 3 month ban. 

 

Does Caer honestly think ozn has the intelligence of a 2 year old? Does he think ozn thought the entire zone would somehow not notice or see him repel players away during a fight in an attempt to cheat? does Caer honestly think ozn thought he could get away with something like that? what kind of backwards and stupid logic is that? it's like robbing a bank on camera without a mask, ozn may be a dick head sometimes, but he's not retarded.

[Legacy]

In reply to three, why would Ozn have ANY reason to believe he had a CHANCE of surviving the (easily) 2000+ damage inflicted on him, while frozen with an EMP? I had numerous spectators say I had well more nrg than Ozn and not for the TK I would hv survived. That would be completely crazy for Ozn to think he was merely 'frozen at 0'...that's a little hardheaded to exhibit such a scenario... It is also funny how every player from CM logs on and threatens to quit the game because they might get screwed out of 1 player playing. My response to that is Outlaws played the game with half our reg players missing and we didn't bitch once about it. Legacy

[Legacy]

But like I said before. I want a good game regardless of what happened. In anycase, we can sit here all day and speculate. Its time for caer to grab his balls and give an explanation. Legacy

[Mop]

It's not just CM players that are upset about this abuse.  A lot of us are uncomfortable knowing we could be banned at any moment for trivial nonsense without explanation or justification.

 

I don't think any punishment is warranted for this, but at the very worst, I could understand Ozn having to burn 1 repel from his ship next game.  Even then, that would have more of an impact on game 2 than Ozn's actions had on game 1. 

 

I also think Caer should be reminded that banning players on opposing teams, especially without providing a prompt and reasonable explanation, should not be tolerated.

[Three]

In reply to three, why would Ozn have ANY reason to believe he had a CHANCE of surviving the (easily) 2000+ damage inflicted on him, while frozen with an EMP? I had numerous spectators say I had well more nrg than Ozn and not for the TK I would hv survived. That would be completely crazy for Ozn to think he was merely 'frozen at 0'...that's a little hardheaded to exhibit such a scenario... It is also funny how every player from CM logs on and threatens to quit the game because they might get screwed out of 1 player playing. My response to that is Outlaws played the game with half our reg players missing and we didn't bitch once about it. Legacy

 

You really are that fucking stupid aren't you? When you die and the glitch happens, you appear with 0 energy right where you have died. With the amount of practices you have played after your UPS route, I'm sure you've seen this glitch. How you're being willfully dense about it makes me want to take a sledgehammer to the billing server.

 

You're missing the point completely. He didn't cheat. He protected himself from getting another death (and given how the sysop has reacted to this situation - the extra death Ozn would have accumulated very well may have counted). Christ, look at the SFE score a few weeks ago: http://svssubspace.com/index.php?page=Game&id=1285912&season=16. How does someone win 13-0? Yeah... exactly.

 

Ozn reacted in under a second being frozen at zero energy with a repel. The repel had NO effect on the game outcome, none. It wasn't malicious in intent. It wasn't done deliberately to mess up the game. It didn't cause anyone to use an item - it didn't cause damage to one of your squad mates. It didn't cause any of the players in the match to take more or less damage. He didn't attach and turn towards your squad, move forward, fire a Thor and then repel.

 

I'm glad you're squad is happy to play a team that now will be hamstrung because the sysop abuses his powers and bans someone who DEFENDED HIMSELF. It's a game/bot glitch.

 

You like how people are threatening to quit.... The fucking sysop of the game is abusing his powers. Why the hell would my team mates or I want to play a game where someone cheats? People have better things to do on Father's Day than show up to play matches in a video game. I sure can't wait to play matches on Thanksgiving weekend this year. The guy needs to GO.

 

You weren't missing half of your starters you were missing one and we were missing one.

 

Unfucking real.

 

Edit: do you notice how basically the entire league feels the same way? Mindriot and Psycho Psematic would rather tell us to die in a fire than say good luck or see us win. They are saying the same things we are. They can see this is blatent. When they agree with us, in tandem with the rest of the league, then you can ship it there is something wrong. The fact I have to point this out to you.. just jesus. Wake the fuck up.

Edited July 16, 2014 by Three

[Bargeld]

While players in league matches use outside scripts to toggle x-radar without even being told "don't do that".

[treachen]

In reply to three, why would Ozn have ANY reason to believe he had a CHANCE of surviving the (easily) 2000+ damage inflicted on him, while frozen with an EMP? I had numerous spectators say I had well more nrg than Ozn and not for the TK I would hv survived. That would be completely crazy for Ozn to think he was merely 'frozen at 0'...that's a little hardheaded to exhibit such a scenario... It is also funny how every player from CM logs on and threatens to quit the game because they might get screwed out of 1 player playing. My response to that is Outlaws played the game with half our reg players missing and we didn't bitch once about it. Legacy

 

Legacy, I still plan on finishing the season regardless of the outcome. This has become a much greater issue and I think it needs to be resolved now.  If you swapped places with ozn and you were banned I wouldn't change my opinion. The decision was made hastily without due consideration.  The appeal was simply ignored and everyone else in this game seems to be powerless against any decision he decides to make.  Your argument is that if OZN gets "away" with it, then anybody else can get away with it.  I'd counter by saying if Caerbannog can get away with shotgun banning pilots without any explanation, then it will happen again in the future and I don't want to be part of it.

Edited July 16, 2014 by treachen

[cash flow king]

I have to say...  The fact that so many people who dislike each other in this game unanimously agree on this issue speaks volumes. I think even Dre, if he wasn't locked up in prison for beating his wife, would agree on this issue.

[Aquitas]

This all comes down to a lack of education.  This was all cleared up in my post page 1.  There is NO argument that if OZN had (intentionally or not) attach + used an item after a 3rd death it would be illegal and result in a REASONABLE punishment. Also, there is NO argument that if OZN had died out and respawned normally to a random area of the map and REPELLED that it would STILL be illegal even if no one was around.  However as clearly stated in my original post, as well as others, neither of these scenarios was the case.  

 

NO ONE, INCLUDING CAERBANNOQ, can say that Ozn died out and respawned normally to a random location on the map then attached to a teammate and repelled before being put in spec.  That just simply was not what happened and IF OZN did not die normally and respawn to a random location on the map before being specced whatever happened afterwards is UNPLANNED glitch.

 

Once again we will go over what happened. OZN died, the server glitched causing him to never respawn and he was floating in the same spot with 0 energy and the same items as before his death. This unplanned glitch which MIMICKS that no death had actually occurred, caused OZN to repel to save himself.  We must be reasonable here... I understand legacy and those of you with exciting imaginations can conjure up thousands of what if scenario's and point out parallels between a glitch and cheating but the point is... THE GAME GLITCHED, what happened after is irrelevant because the glitch was out of his control or pre-meditated knowledge.  Now, some can argue well the fact that after 3 deaths there is time to attach to someone (WHICH OZN DID NOT) and fire an item is a glitch.. That is true but that is KNOWN glitch and therefore if acted upon is dealt with reprimand since the knowledge of its existence is the reason why the RULE against it EXISTS.  However, notice how there is no rule against the legality of glitches... the reason is because there unpredictable... and called a GLITCH.  Some of you will argue, as shown above, that ozn must be an IDIOT for not realizing that his death was an OVER kill and that there should have been NO way on earth that he could have possibly thought he survived- Therefore glitch or not he should of just sat there at 0 energy with bullets coming at him and went AGAINST EVERY NATURAL INSTINCT in his 18 years of experience of playing subspace to repel.and IF HE ISN'T able to control this INSTINCT then he is a CHEATER and deserves a 90 day ban... I want to remind you that between the time that OZN died out and the glitch occurred leading to his instinctive repel and finally being specced was only a few seconds.  Read that sentence a couple times out loud if you like... doesn't it sound ridiculous?  I will repeat myself, lets be reasonable.

 

AGAIN, The reason why the rule and consequences exists for a player who dies out and fires an item or attaches and fires an item before being specced is because its a known bug/glitch that disrupts the game. AGAIN, a glitch that occurs not prior to our knowledge is not of consequence and not premeditated and can not be the fault of the person(s) involved.   What would of happened if this occurred during OZN's second death and because of the glitch he got killed again a second later because of being in the same spot as his death and died out.  Would we count that one death as 2 deaths?  Or what would of happened if he did what he did and repelled to save himself... would we grant him a ship change for a full ship since he had to use a repel because of a glitch? Or would he have to play at a disadvantage his third life 1 repel down?  OR WOULD WE DO WHAT WE ARE DOING NOW AND BAN HIM FOR 90 DAYS ???

 

The reason why none of you can answer the above question is because this glitch,which is very rare but happens, is not in the rules because it can't be premeditated upon.  However, dieing out and being a jerk by attaching to someone to shoot off an item before being specced, that is pre-meditated and deserves punishment.

 

Lets be reasonable and somewhat educated about this. 

[mindriot]

This all comes down to a lack of education.  This was all cleared up in my post page 1.  There is NO argument that if OZN had (intentionally or not) attach + used an item after a 3rd death it would be illegal and result in a REASONABLE punishment. Also, there is NO argument that if OZN had died out and respawned normally to a random area of the map and REPELLED that it would STILL be illegal even if no one was around.  However as clearly stated in my original post, as well as others, neither of these scenarios was the case.  

 

NO ONE, INCLUDING CAERBANNOQ, can say that Ozn died out and respawned normally to a random location on the map then attached to a teammate and repelled before being put in spec.  That just simply was not what happened and IF OZN did not die normally and respawn to a random location on the map before being specced whatever happened afterwards is UNPLANNED glitch.

 

Once again we will go over what happened. OZN died, the server glitched causing him to never respawn and he was floating in the same spot with 0 energy and the same items as before his death. This unplanned glitch which MIMICKS that no death had actually occurred, caused OZN to repel to save himself.  We must be reasonable here... I understand legacy and those of you with exciting imaginations can conjure up thousands of what if scenario's and point out parallels between a glitch and cheating but the point is... THE GAME GLITCHED, what happened after is irrelevant because the glitch was out of his control or pre-meditated knowledge.  Now, some can argue well the fact that after 3 deaths there is time to attach to someone (WHICH OZN DID NOT) and fire an item is a glitch.. That is true but that is KNOWN glitch and therefore if acted upon is dealt with reprimand since the knowledge of its existence is the reason why the RULE against it EXISTS.  However, notice how there is no rule against the legality of glitches... the reason is because there unpredictable... and called a GLITCH.  Some of you will argue, as shown above, that ozn must be an IDIOT for not realizing that his death was an OVER kill and that there should have been NO way on earth that he could have possibly thought he survived- Therefore glitch or not he should of just sat there at 0 energy with bullets coming at him and went AGAINST EVERY NATURAL INSTINCT in his 18 years of experience of playing subspace to repel.and IF HE ISN'T able to control this INSTINCT then he is a CHEATER and deserves a 90 day ban... I want to remind you that between the time that OZN died out and the glitch occurred leading to his instinctive repel and finally being specced was only a few seconds.  Read that sentence a couple times out loud if you like... doesn't it sound ridiculous?  I will repeat myself, lets be reasonable.

 

AGAIN, The reason why the rule and consequences exists for a player who dies out and fires an item or attaches and fires an item before being specced is because its a known bug/glitch that disrupts the game. AGAIN, a glitch that occurs not prior to our knowledge is not of consequence and not premeditated and can not be the fault of the person(s) involved.   What would of happened if this occurred during OZN's second death and because of the glitch he got killed again a second later because of being in the same spot as his death and died out.  Would we count that one death as 2 deaths?  Or what would of happened if he did what he did and repelled to save himself... would we grant him a ship change for a full ship since he had to use a repel because of a glitch? Or would he have to play at a disadvantage his third life 1 repel down?  OR WOULD WE DO WHAT WE ARE DOING NOW AND BAN HIM FOR 90 DAYS ???

 

The reason why none of you can answer the above question is because this glitch,which is very rare but happens, is not in the rules because it can't be premeditated upon.  However, dieing out and being a jerk by attaching to someone to shoot off an item before being specced, that is pre-meditated and deserves punishment.

 

Lets be reasonable and somewhat educated about this. 

 

 

I think at this point not lifting the ban will be dumber than the ban itself.

 

Ozn should be free to play the next game with a full ship. 

 

Also, the next match between Critical Mass and Outlaws may just cause the Universe to implode. 

 

I'm starting to think this is all a PR stunt to generate spectators.

 

Well played. I am thoroughly intrigued. 

 

Free Ozn.

[Captor]

Hi Ozn!

 

This is in handle on council.

 

I'm more than sure, that we'll see fast decisions from those guys.

[Legacy]

 

In reply to three, why would Ozn have ANY reason to believe he had a CHANCE of surviving the (easily) 2000+ damage inflicted on him, while frozen with an EMP? I had numerous spectators say I had well more nrg than Ozn and not for the TK I would hv survived. That would be completely crazy for Ozn to think he was merely 'frozen at 0'...that's a little hardheaded to exhibit such a scenario... It is also funny how every player from CM logs on and threatens to quit the game because they might get screwed out of 1 player playing. My response to that is Outlaws played the game with half our reg players missing and we didn't bitch once about it. Legacy

 

You really are that fucking stupid aren't you? When you die and the glitch happens, you appear with 0 energy right where you have died. With the amount of practices you have played after your UPS route, I'm sure you've seen this glitch. How you're being willfully dense about it makes me want to take a sledgehammer to the billing server.

 

You're missing the point completely. He didn't cheat. He protected himself from getting another death (and given how the sysop has reacted to this situation - the extra death Ozn would have accumulated very well may have counted). Christ, look at the SFE score a few weeks ago: http://svssubspace.com/index.php?page=Game&id=1285912&season=16. How does someone win 13-0? Yeah... exactly.

 

Ozn reacted in under a second being frozen at zero energy with a repel. The repel had NO effect on the game outcome, none. It wasn't malicious in intent. It wasn't done deliberately to mess up the game. It didn't cause anyone to use an item - it didn't cause damage to one of your squad mates. It didn't cause any of the players in the match to take more or less damage. He didn't attach and turn towards your squad, move forward, fire a Thor and then repel.

 

I'm glad you're squad is happy to play a team that now will be hamstrung because the sysop abuses his powers and bans someone who DEFENDED HIMSELF. It's a game/bot glitch.

 

You like how people are threatening to quit.... The fucking sysop of the game is abusing his powers. Why the hell would my team mates or I want to play a game where someone cheats? People have better things to do on Father's Day than show up to play matches in a video game. I sure can't wait to play matches on Thanksgiving weekend this year. The guy needs to GO.

 

You weren't missing half of your starters you were missing one and we were missing one.

 

Unfucking real.

 

Edit: do you notice how basically the entire league feels the same way? Mindriot and Psycho Psematic would rather tell us to die in a fire than say good luck or see us win. They are saying the same things we are. They can see this is blatent. When they agree with us, in tandem with the rest of the league, then you can ship it there is something wrong. The fact I have to point this out to you.. just jesus. Wake the fuck up.

 

 

u dont see 0 nrg and assume u didnt die when u were obviously OVERKILLED Lol...did he think he was gonna drop that 2000+ damage coming at him at once? none the less, when ur desperate, i guess ull come up with whatever u can to make it sound believable...

 

"Three> I'm glad you're squad is happy to play a team that now will be hamstrung because the sysop abuses his powers and bans someone who DEFENDED HIMSELF."

 

And of course, i come to the boards after never posting to read what this is all about and sure enough, i come across the biggest shit-stain in league (three) ranting like a 3 year old... 

 

Do you even read? r u so busy running ur trap u cant stop to see that Outlaws r not worried about if he plays or not. u can play 4 ozn's if u want. we dont give a flying-fuck-twat who u start. ur mouth seems to run on overdrive when ur team is up 1 game. i dont recall hearing anything from u beforehand. save it or u just mind end up eating those words.

 

Legacy

Edited July 16, 2014 by Legacy