Basing BTY

[vetta64]

I was in a mid day flag game today and we shall call it, the same thing happens every day. 1 team takes the base and the other team rage quits. My immediate response was Rage Quit is ruining Hyperspace, literally. Of course you already know this.

 

Now this is my solution to the problem and I know that not everyone agrees:

 

1. Bring back basing bty with leech money for teammates.

2. decrease the importance / reward for a flag game win.

 

The result is that 1 person bountying in a base becomes more important to protect than the flags, and the longer he can hold out the more he and his team can make.

 

This will not result in rage quit phenomena because it will become worth while for people on the "winning" team to hop to the "losing" team just to kill the bountyer.

 

I understand that people will hesitate leaving the winning team, but if they have no enemies to kill they will eventually have to hop.

 

The flags would get the game going, but once its started the bty takes over. Once this is started the team has to work together to keep the btyer from dying while still letting him get kills because thats where the money is. This will actually bring the team together more than flagging basically because people already make more from kills in a flag game than they do from winning.

 

Furthermore, and this is sound logic if I ever heard it, . . . people like to bty, to get good at it and to see how high they get, and who had the highest bty ever etc.

 

I will now summarize my argument:

 

Please bring back basing bty!

 

 

PS I forgot to add that both teams can actually "win" at the same time if they have good btyers.

Edited May 14, 2010 by vetta64

[kid]

tl;dr

 

not going to happen

[Cheese]

its a great idea, and its how it used to be, but unfortunately it will indeed never happen because Dr Brain has decided he does not want it.

[Dr Brain]

its a great idea, and its how it used to be, but unfortunately it will indeed never happen because Dr Brain has decided he does not want it.

That's right. My mission in life is to make you guys miserable.

 

Seriously, bountying in basing was removed because it was detracting from the flag game. It would cause games to last for hours, which is not what I'm looking for. I want quickly cycling games.

[Cheese]

but hour long flag games are awesome ;_;

[vetta64]

I know your goal is not to have more people play in the zone. However, from a player perspective, more people equals more potential (kills, money, fun, whatever). Also, even if people say they don't like flag games, they sure do all show up when a flag game is happening. What is happening now is that the rage quiting leaves the zone practically empty and someone looks and say "eh, there is noone on. I will play anything else." This ends up being a cycle of people that might have played but only if other people where playing. Long flag. Games would fix this problem better that the way it is now.

 

Like I said, I understand that this is not really your goal. I knew when I first posted that you don't like the idea of basing bounty, otherwisw we would still have it. However, that doesn't prevent us from being free to repeatedly make the request, does it?

[Samapico]

but hour long flag games are awesome ;_;

But not hour long flag games where people just sit back to get kills http://www.ssforum.net/public/style_emoticons/default/blum.gif

[Kilo]

That's the simplest way to put it but the reasons are more complex than that. It's ludicrous to claim that flag games were really fought over flags. The flags back in that time were more like the objects that people politely (hah) used to determine who ran themselves through on the other team's death traps. Winning the flag game meant giving up that right so people almost never wanted to do it. That's not really a "flag" game at all. Not to mention that there was absolutely no skill at all in the kills in the ultraconfined and clustered space of a base, whose rewards would get progressively higher for no real reason other than you had not died (or run out of ammo, which was one of the compromises to try to control the ridiculousness.) Eventually Brain decided that HS needed to have a real objective besides press button win lots of money, like it used to.

 

Hour long flag games aren't impressive if they're stupid. Before bounty bonus nonsense, hour long flag games were truly epic, mostly because they weren't artificially inflated. It was a great idea only insofar as having a "press button repeatedly--win money repeatedly" game is great. There was no substance to the gameplay and it undermined not only real flag games but also the whole HS economy.

Edited May 15, 2010 by Kilo

[Emit]

Why not change something up, like making bounty a person has a multiplier of some sort. Thus, "bountying" still works, but for both campers and rushers.

 

Something along the lines of (Since bty all starts at 20)

Money gain = [(Player bty x killed bty )/15]/2

(Formula can be tweaked however much money you want to give)

 

To prevent the whole milking idea, since the flaggers are already split into two freqs making it easier to manage, just have a restriction binding players from milking for kills. Everytime someone hits over 500 bounty, the start back from 20.

Edited May 18, 2010 by Emit

[kid]

That's right. My mission in life is to make you guys miserable.

 

Seriously, bountying in basing was removed because it was detracting from the flag game. It would cause games to last for hours, which is not what I'm looking for. I want quickly cycling games.

Is this why there is an extra 100 seconds delay to winning after the flags are dropped?

[Dr Brain]

100 seconds is not hours. Cycling flag games so fast that there's no competition is worse than never ending games.

[kid]

No, but I think it is ridiculous to say that the 100 added seconds only increase game time by 100 seconds.

[Dr Brain]

I'm not sure what you're implying.

[Samapico]

It adds a high tension moment, and makes the losing team realize that they have to hurry up. By the way, some kind of 'All flags dropped' warning (graphic or text) would be cool.

Also, it's better to have +100 seconds with all flags dropped than to add 100 seconds to the drop delay, because during those 100 seconds with all flags dropped, the game becomes more intense not only because the losing team has to hurry, but also because the defenders get at least 1 more guy to shoot stuff.

 

And as Brain said, it would be way too easy to quickwin in just 200 seconds...

[vetta64]

There comes a time in every organization (zone) that some of the "old" tactics that didn't work in the past begin to work again because the culture, players, or cicrumstances of the organization (zone) have changed.

 

Instead of saying "that never worked before". Why not try something again now that so much else has changed around the zone.

 

Also, please don't mistake my request for basing bty as a complaint. If I didn't enjoy HS I wouldn't play. (unless I was hopelessly addicted that is http://www.ssforum.net/public/style_emoticons/default/facepalm.gif )

[kid]

I'm not sure what you're implying.

I am implying that without the 100 second added delay, lots of games would last hours less than they do.

[Dr Brain]

I already said "Cycling flag games so fast that there's no competition is worse than never ending games."

 

There comes a time in every organization (zone) that some of the "old" tactics that didn't work in the past begin to work again because the culture, players, or cicrumstances of the organization (zone) have changed.

 

Instead of saying "that never worked before". Why not try something again now that so much else has changed around the zone.

 

Trying the same thing while expecting different results is the definition of insanity. There's no reason to think it would work now.

[Kilo]

^Also every reason to believe that nothing has really changed since you are asking for a feature so fundamentally corrupts the gameplay and culture.

 

 

Why exactly are you whining about the 100 second delay as if it made games longer? The total amount of time between the last flag carrier picking up flags and winning the flag game has not changed very much at all in recent history (it used to be shorter, along the order of 3 minutes, back when team sizes didn't scale very high, so flag carriers created a bigger gap on your team.) It used to be that flag carriers had to hold it for longer but then there was a shorter amount of time after the last drop to the win. But that's more advantageous to the offense, because a defender is tied up for longer. So now you can drop faster but then the extra time is made up when all flags are dropped, increasing the defensive fire power without risking resetting any timers, leading to a more sure win and a faster flag game. More incentive to drop too because it won't tie you up personally as long, too, so flags get dropped faster.

[vetta64]

http://www.amazon.com/Good-Great-Companies-Leap-Others/dp/0066620996

 

Read that, might help the zone.

[»D1st0rt]

we need to increase our ROI, it's currently negative

[Kilo]

You're right... you want easy cash, so we should give it to you. We should make the game appeal to the lowest common denominator and make "winning" skillless, fun fleeting, and gameplay meaningless just so we can be "great." Actually, never mind, that would be too much of a shock to our pride. So I will wish you best of luck in applying your knowledge of making things great to "press button win lots of money" zone.

 

P.S. D1 is secretly embezzling the rounded-off decimals in every HS transaction.

[vetta64]

how is basing bty "push button" winning. When all one has to do to win a flag game is be in the right place at the right time?

 

Not only does an individual person not have to be helpful to the team in order to make lots of money, but they can actually spend the entire time negatively impacting that team, and still win.

 

Also, since you (arnk) automatically assume that everyone posting on the forum is dumber than dirt, let me reitterate that I like the zone the way it is. I enjoy playing. However, there are some aspects of the game that I think can be improved. Unless that is you think the team evener is actually working?

[Kilo]

I don't automatically assume it's dumber than dirt. I make that conclusion after reading it. But seriously, I don't know the status of the team evener, I was unable to use my ideas for that one, so I haven't been paying attention anymore. Either way, that has nothing to do with base-bounty (which is push-button-winning for the reasons stated above.) You have a legitimate point about negative-factors getting in on the reward, but they could do that under any system anyway, so that is also irrelevant to this particular side-discussion.

[»D1st0rt]

P.S. D1 is secretly embezzling the rounded-off decimals in every HS transaction.

cypher is actually doing this, but only when he is online

[Dr Brain]

No, he was collecting the money from fines. Not the round offs.