this is pathetic

[Lera]

Tonight there was a base game...late but an actual base game.

The jp got high and next thing you know oppressors hop from pub to private, take over base and win jp.

 

I can understand if NO ONE was playing, but the game was 15v15 for the longest time. As soon as it drooped to 10v10 boom they swooped in and stole the jp from the hard working pub. Unix wasn't even playing the whole base game, she was doing trivia for the first half.

The jackpot didn't get this big on its own, and it is not fair it was locked to a selected few, especially since the pub freq was about to win.

 

Oppressors won flag game. Reward: $15254 (1 exp)

Opposing team won (15676 points given)

Fat Mouse

Raw-!@#$%^&*

Unix

A Pun

lvlelvlo

domio

 

something should be done, this is ridiculous

 

lol then they try to buy us back....maybe what we wanted was to base, and the opps ruined it.

 

You were granted $5000 For staying

BongSmoker> who granted 5000

Unix> -/?grant 5000 For staying

Edited May 23, 2008 by Lera

[weasel]

yea i quit for a while because every time a base game happens, a priv ruins it. imo privs should be limited to 3 people. that's enough to win the game with the current setup of being able to carry 2 flags each and limit them to the point where they cant take over an 8 person public freq. hope something gets done about this cus im about to quit again. no fun if every base game keeps getting ruined.

 

and yo why is a jrmod aka unix ruining flag games 3 days in a row and then complaining in 50 topics about there being a lack of flag games and "ways to create balance" sounds like he's contributing more to the problem than the solution.

[Dadoc]

They do it all the time. Just last nite i picked up the last flag for a pub freq and Fat Mouse, who was on the other pub, changed to my freq. Unix was already on the freq. I dropped it but someone trailing managed to get it before i could kill him, Fat mouse kills him before me and runs with it. (Interesting how he didn't try much to kill him before while i was still carrying it.)

 

Expecting him to neut now because they have done this before, i follow him and as soon as he realizes, he goes to center where unix has changed to priv and lets her kill him and changes to the same priv. AIG is now out of spec and on this same priv playing bodyguard for unix in center while FM and anyone else who may have joined can grab the flags.

 

This happens like daily. Today, when they did it, all the people on the pub freqs left the zone or went to spec because they knew the routine already. Pubs went from 12+ per freq to 5 or 6 on both freqs combined. It's because iit is basically impossible to beat a stacked team with a pub team when the other pub is there with nothing to do but flank you and when most of the team is flying around with only stock to mid level javs and wbs sometimes no lanc or one lanc without summon. Not to mention shipchanging thor lobbers.

 

They say that they decided to priv as a squad (although this has been going on basically since the turret thing has died down-way before the squad was in existence), but if this is the case, why decide to priv only when jp is high and one of the teams is about to win, at basically everytime? It's so easy to find flags when they have been lit up on your map in yellow. Why not priv earlier at the very least? That way, at least those who win the jp can say they earned it and not steal it from the rest of the pub teams hard work.

 

 

Weasel,

Unix is trying to get people to flag so the jp can keep rising and they can make more money. Unix cares little about even teams and only about making money for herself (and maybe a few "squaddies") at everyone elses expense. They will do things like pull back to make a weaker team think they are doing something and not give up on attacking when they can't manage to enter a base. In this scenario, if you win, fine you earned it. But the hopping on priv when a pub freq is about to win to steal a jp everytime seems like too much to me.

[9vgnc3eZ01]

See, some fool doesn't know how base games get balance. Arnk has center nailed down like a pro. But when it comes to basing it all falls apart. First of all, the bones of basing, repels and bursts, need to go back to free/extremely close to it. Item spamming has not been reduced AT ALL, unless you count the superiority complex of basing. Rushers STILL rush like an item spammer, except now other people don't have repels to counter with. Thats all that happened with this BS ammoed burst and repels. Simply bring it back to infinity, and now everyone can counter each other and sharks won't be a problem anymore. Even a noob can actually do something just by spamming bursts and repels without worrying about their income. As much as the dev's failure of logic may disagree, BASING ACTUALLY GETS SOMEWHERE. AND THATS GOOD.

 

Basing needs to be more noob friendly, period. You can complain about how your team sucks all you want, but you hoping for the fantasy. Either your team is pro, or 3/4 of your team doesn't rep. It's that simple right now, so encourage reps and bursts again. Or you can not believe me, but don't blame me for trying to stop the superiority problem that lopsides games. Maybe there's a better way to do it, or maybe this doesn't even work. But its better than just doing absolutely nothing about it.

 

And yeah, I'm pissed. Private domination like this shouldn't be happening, but we all know basing is designed to suiting the pros.

Edited May 23, 2008 by Relos

[Lera]

We had a perfect flag game going, freq 1 would hold for a while then it would switch over to the other freq. The only reason it was going so long is b/c pub knew in the end once everyone got tired one team would win, thats why only half the team gives up. Others stick around to get the bonus at the end for their hard work. Whats makes me most mad, is people like unix/domio (or in any case-anyone who enters in the big middle of the game) can play for 10 min then decide all the jp is thiers and no one elses. I think it is bs.

 

It is even worse when a mod of the arena who promotes "more basing" kills the !@#$%^&* pub game to feed their own greedy needs.

Edited May 23, 2008 by Lera

[Exiili]

O_o

 

Look at the hissy fit unix threw on my joke-thread. He's going to bloody explode for this and it's going to be amusing.

[Suicide_Run]

Either your team is pro, or 3/4 of your team doesn't rep.

Man....that is so dam true.

 

I wouldnt say dev has a failure of logics. In theory, the current reps and burst works pretty well. But in reality...it just doesnt cut it because of greed.

 

Dev need to realize that even if usage of reps+burst barely break even on attack or at least for me cause im able to kill with 3 burst + 4 reps. Most people wont bother to use them cause they usually dont earn a profit.

 

Also...I wouldnt really push all the blame on a player. Its more like players cause theres too many players that waits to hop onto the defending when they already have TONS of money to begin with. Ficking greedy ASSS.

[f3ar-evil]

Unix argues that she's only ruined 1 flag game as of yesterday, but as of now, that's 3 that I KNOW OF and possibly up to like 7-10

 

The Oppressors just want to ruin FGs and get money for themselves, I don't get why. Is it fun to ruin FGs? You have no one attacking and your bty just sux. You get 2 pubs flanking each other, then the pop dies after win... Is that your idea of fun?

 

Seriously, learn to not just serve yourselves and help others have fun as well. After all, HS isn't about being the best or having the most crap. it's about having fun. If you think it's about having the best stuff... it shows when you're top 1 in everything in top 10 list.

 

Especially the fact that Unix is a mod just ruins this. Mods are supposed to exemplify what a good player should act like. If a good player is supposed to ruin FGs... well that's the message that is getting across.

[James1293]

HS isn't about being the best or having the most crap. it's about having fun.

Sorry, but there is a large group of people that think the opposite (not including me).

 

I don't have any suggestions, but many of the ones on this page seem possible.

[Traced.]

haxing unix wold be a good start.

 

stopping priv from winning/ruining fg's would be a good start.

[»D1st0rt]

Oppressors new Brickwarp ITT. Some of this goes back to my previous post.

 

Even a noob can actually do something just by spamming bursts and repels without worrying about their income.

This is exactly what we wanted to do away with, if everyone is just spamming bursts and repels it makes for some crappy flag games. Historically there have been a lot of things that I have wanted to keep free or low cost because the rich will always be able to use them with impunity. However in this case I believe that to do so would send us back into the item spam !@#$%^&* we have worked so hard to get out of. From what I have seen, item usage hasn't been that bad but if it becomes a serious problem we may investigate additional/alternate limits to impose.

[U.U]

rly sucks when they do that

[Syrith]

They do it all the time. Just last nite i picked up the last flag for a pub freq and Fat Mouse, who was on the other pub, changed to my freq. Unix was already on the freq. I dropped it but someone trailing managed to get it before i could kill him, Fat mouse kills him before me and runs with it. (Interesting how he didn't try much to kill him before while i was still carrying it.)

 

Expecting him to neut now because they have done this before, i follow him and as soon as he realizes, he goes to center where unix has changed to priv and lets her kill him and changes to the same priv. AIG is now out of spec and on this same priv playing bodyguard for unix in center while FM and anyone else who may have joined can grab the flags.

 

Sounds like flagtrading to me.

[Domio]

Ok...enough of the crying and everything...You dont even do anything but just spec. Most of the

time we win it is because everyone has specced and just start crying. It just shows how easy you

want everything to be. Well sometimes it wont be. You guys are just as good as we are. You just

dont spend as much money on reps, bursts and fields as we do to win it. And we have the proper

ships to win. Unlike some who just spend money pointlessly upgrading ships in the dumbest way

for basing. But to add to this, Sharks play a big role. Most of the people on the squad do have a

shark.

 

P.S. You make more money playing then in spec.

[protocol_]

You guys are just as good as we are. You just

dont spend as much money on reps, bursts and fields as we do to win it. And we have the proper

ships to win. Unlike some who just spend money pointlessly upgrading ships in the dumbest way

for basing.

 

We don't spend as much money as you all do because we DON'T have the money to waste. I think nearly 85% of the zone are still trying to build up basing ships that will benefit the rest of us. I've been trying to make a lanc for a couple days now and when the flag game gets going everyone hops to the defending team and/or make that greedy priv and win the jp for themselves. We don't waste money on fields, reps, thors, and bursts because we are still trying to save up for our ships.

[9vgnc3eZ01]

Oppressors new Brickwarp ITT. Some of this goes back to my previous post.

 

Even a noob can actually do something just by spamming bursts and repels without worrying about their income.

This is exactly what we wanted to do away with, if everyone is just spamming bursts and repels it makes for some crappy flag games. Historically there have been a lot of things that I have wanted to keep free or low cost because the rich will always be able to use them with impunity. However in this case I believe that to do so would send us back into the item spam !@#$%^&* we have worked so hard to get out of. From what I have seen, item usage hasn't been that bad but if it becomes a serious problem we may investigate additional/alternate limits to impose.

 

Ok let me tell you something D1: THERE IS STILL ITEM SPAMMING GOING ON ANYWAY! It may not be as obvious as before, but there is still a form of it (I find worse) happening now.

 

You know whats the different? (And I thought this was common knowledge too...):

 

Only a few are using them. This means they completely dominate others in basing, esp. more so when their all grouped on on a team. This few...

 

item spam. Welcome, you have just now widened the gap between pros and newbs. Is that fine?

 

The solution I have proposed would simply make basing a more fair event. We know by now that a majority of pub doesn't buy bursts and repels, for whatever reason, to closen this gap. But hey, if they did, you would see a flag composed of (fanfare)

 

Item spamming.

 

At least we'll see a fair battle, but thats pretty much what HS is doomed to be with its current style. If you just hate the term "item spamming" and want a fair pushing battle AND the lack of it, open your eyes.

 

Its not happening right now.

 

You'll have to make repels and bursts, the backbone of today's HS basing, MUCH more expensive. The desire is to reduce spamming... and if you want that, make it higher than we can earn money per kill. Say, $100 per repel and $200 per burst? Buff them if desired. The style of basing would now change.

 

Of course, now you have the problem of gunliners. It must also be dealt with.

 

I don't know what style of basing you want, D1st0rt. Find one. And don't get any illusions about the current basing either, because you only have to watch basing for a few seconds to see a item spammer (they call them rushers). Theoretically every ship could do that, if one could find it economically feasable to do. THEN, in this new situation, it would be more than obvious. However, its still happening now, only with a superiority edge. Please try to understand what this means. (Hint: the pop.)

 

This current basing format won't work, especially when privates abuse it like right now. You can balance the amount of "good people" on a team (impossible with current team balancing methods and privs). Or 2, lessen the amount of money it takes to do what is effective in basing (and this statement is broad for a reason), causing a better balance between pros and newbs equaling more fair base fights where even a team with little money could put pressure on some great team of pros. However you want to get there, let me just tell you this: that is what the call a "preferable situation". I hope thats how the devs think as well, or you can just screw my whole post, everything I said in this thread, and every complaint I made as well.

 

EDIT: I read the your previous post. It would be nice if things went that way, and its a solution if it happened often enough... but when even Unix would hop to a priv (for good reasons even) I don't think it will work ATM.

 

Ok...enough of the crying and everything...You dont even do anything but just spec. Most of the

time we win it is because everyone has specced and just start crying. It just shows how easy you

want everything to be. Well sometimes it wont be. You guys are just as good as we are. You just

dont spend as much money on reps, bursts and fields as we do to win it. And we have the proper

ships to win. Unlike some who just spend money pointlessly upgrading ships in the dumbest way

for basing. But to add to this, Sharks play a big role. Most of the people on the squad do have a

shark.

 

P.S. You make more money playing then in spec.

 

Aka: you are dedicated pros or a team with good ships, Domio. There wan't enough left in the latest flaggame who just happened to be strong enough to take you on, and those you could've couldn't keep their lancs alive long enough. Obviously you were the better team, and thats why you won. I won't say anymore about why... I have said enough already.

Edited May 25, 2008 by Relos

[Dr Brain]

You're arguing that we should change a 1 on the fun scale to a 2 on the fun scale. We're looking for solutions to make basing fun, not solutions to make basing "more fun but still suck". Going back to item spam qualifies as that type of solution. It simply won't happen.

[Unix]

No one even tried to mount an attach against us. No one, not even once.

 

Little known fact - Privs are a mere shadow of what they once were prior to reset. A team of 10 decent ships can wipe out ANY priv.

 

Notice, 5 of the 6 of the Oppressors could be considered "maxed out", one of them is still gaining money.

 

People need to stop complaining and actually do something rather than just throw up their hands and just say, "we lose". Of course there's a problem with the entire basing theme if your mentality is like that.

 

There's very little that separates a decent ship and a maxed out ship whether you like to believe it or not. Even my ships arent maxed out (other than my WB), but even then, it's not a big difference. People just give up too easily, and privs are NOT the ones to blame for that.

[weasel]

No one even tried to mount an attach against us. No one, not even once.

 

Little known fact - Privs are a mere shadow of what they once were prior to reset. A team of 10 decent ships can wipe out ANY priv.

 

Notice, 5 of the 6 of the Oppressors could be considered "maxed out", one of them is still gaining money.

 

People need to stop complaining and actually do something rather than just throw up their hands and just say, "we lose". Of course there's a problem with the entire basing theme if your mentality is like that.

 

There's very little that separates a decent ship and a maxed out ship whether you like to believe it or not. Even my ships arent maxed out (other than my WB), but even then, it's not a big difference. People just give up too easily, and privs are NOT the ones to blame for that.

hope that was a joke. 6 ships with ad against 10 ships without it will dominate.

 

and dr. brain, limit privs to 3 people and nerf shark. garunteed to fix most problems with basing atm.

Edited May 25, 2008 by weasel

[Unix]

It's been proven already before that a team of 10 decent players is greater than a team of 6 maxed out ships.

 

I've been on many privs before, and I've maybe been on one or two where the priv could be considered dominating, and that was before other people get AD. Priving is hard, yet people dont realize it.

 

Limiting to 3 = No chance for a priv to base, it's bad enough as it is

[Matrim Cauthon]

Even a noob can actually do something just by spamming bursts and repels without worrying about their income.

1 ad rush=2 thors, 8 repels, 6bursts... thats $456...wow, no wonder im losing cash all the time

^thats reason most people like me hates to rush properly

[Unix]

Even a noob can actually do something just by spamming bursts and repels without worrying about their income.

1 ad rush=2 thors, 8 repels, 6bursts... thats $456...wow, no wonder im losing cash all the time

^thats reason most people like me hates to rush properly

Half agree

 

I have the same setup and I still make money rushing

[9vgnc3eZ01]

You're arguing that we should change a 1 on the fun scale to a 2 on the fun scale. We're looking for solutions to make basing fun, not solutions to make basing "more fun but still suck". Going back to item spam qualifies as that type of solution. It simply won't happen.

 

Item spamming is happening right now, have you even read my post. The only difference is that its not everyone who is doing it anymore, and it gets abused (for example privs). You not going back to ANYTHING except making more people rush. And if you can remember population, things were better in this so called "unacceptable" item spamming that all devs hate, because, y'know, its "iteming spamming" and its "automatically bad" destroying all fun with it. According to my current opinion thors and bricks spammed screw games, NOT repels and bursts.

 

And even then, you can ignore this last paragraph altogether.

 

My real point from my last post is that current basing sucks, and it needs a solution. I've emphasized the workability of one solution. I was serious that if you REALLY want item spamming gone you could also increase repel and burst cost largely. But as long as you keep items as it is, and as long as privs are ready to abuse it, this item set just won't cut it for basing.

 

I mean, what is the ideal basing anyway? I mean, what it IS, not what is isn't. Once you know what that IS, you work from there. I simply find fun basing as a fair, even battle with your customised ships. I already know achieving this by item spamming does not equal fun, esp. to the HS community. So what kind of basing DOES attract and keep our players?

That question devs would know better than I, and I wonder what it would be.

[Astyanax]

Maybe make item-use based on a timer, e.g., you can't rep more than once every 10 seconds, you can't burst more than once every 5. If that can't be done, perhaps have one repel that recharges after 10 seconds, or one burst that recharges after 5. Possibly make recharge times different on different ships- like rushing ships recharge in 8 seconds for repels, 4 seconds for bursts, or somesuch. Make items cheap/free since item use would be limited by time rather than finances, and you've gone a long way towards leveling the playing field.

 

Making items commonly available raises the importance of having better (and rarer) equipment. Better equipment would still offer a better chance of prevailing, but at least this way, people without money won't just be fodder, they have some chance of actually making money and climbing the ladder of improvement.

 

The current setup punishes people without money, since it takes money to make money. While this sounds good on paper, it fares worse in practice. Since people start off with very little, there's little hope for any new player to actually get ahead in an appreciable time frame. Running on the financial treadmill of the current settings is nothing but a slippery slope- three steps forward, two steps back...and since, in my view, a large part of the appeal of HS is about improvement, the current setup runs cross purpose.

Edited May 25, 2008 by Astyanax

[Matrim Cauthon]

bricks are even worse than bursts and reps, it only costs $265 to buy it, and rich people can just keep buying it and bricking lanc until the other freq quits