Ships

[Unix]

So... Out of all the ships, I think there's a consensus to which ships are over used, under used and used just right.

 

Anything we can do about that to make ships evened out more?

[Dr Brain]

I know nothing about how the ships currently play, but it could be just that the majority of players have a style that is more suited to certain ships. Doesn't mean the other ships are worthless, it means that it takes a certain kind of someone to be successful with them.

[Unix]

The most overused ships are... Terr and Shark (wb and jav dont count since they're starter ships)

 

The most underused ships are.... Spider and Wzl

 

It's more than just style, it's affinity to ease for the ship. There's a reason why people lean to those ships, the same reason why a rushing wzl was the most used basing ship before rest.

[Acer]

I think the terr and shark are overused because people see good players own people with them. If people saw soneone using a terr in base and getting over 300 bty with it they would want to get a terr because of the person getting 300 bty. And samething as the shark, people saw someone own a team with a shark so they decided to get a shark to own a team. So really Dr Brain is right. If soneone didn't care about other people getting 300 bty on a ship they would go off and make there own ship, possibly spider or wzl. But most people just do what other people do to be cool and get money/exp/rec. So there isn't a way to even the ships out. Unless you take away Terr and Shark and make every one buy a spider or wzl. But i doubt any one would agreen on taking away two good ships. Edited April 22, 2008 by Acer101

[Kilo]

There's nothing saying that all ships have to be used equally. Since all ships are used by some people, that is already amazing (since this had not been the case previously), it's hardly surprising "middle" ships like terrier are used a lot and even less of a surprise that ships that are hard to hit (by most people with their horrible aim) are used a lot.

You can't really change the fact that Weasel is very effective when used correctly (you have double-bounce bombs, use them), but not everyone is good enough to do that. Changing ships to be effective based for the lowest level of skill is how you get the old superburstcyclone Weasel.

Edited April 22, 2008 by Kilo

[Suicide_Run]

No real point in evening ships out so ppl use every ship evenly.

 

Thats like saying in a mmorpg, a healer class should have the close/same amount of people using them as a fighter.

[Gar]

Except a well-designed mmorpg shouldn't have classes at all... classes force people into a single specific playstyle, and, last time I checked, being forced into a single playstyle instantly becomes boring the moment your playstyle isn't useful for the situation at hand. Unfortunately, many of the ships have been forced into exactly this kind of lazy design by the new item set.

 

That is why the vast majority of ships are warbird, javelin, terrier, and shark. These four ships are useful in both basing and centering. Remember, players have limited resources which they must allocate to best have fun. If you can only have one ship, you choose one of these. The other four ships are forced into single roles or require enormous amounts of money to be useful for more than one specific role.

[Matrim Cauthon]

the thing is terriers have the highest bullet speed and it has some decent mobility which makes it more preferable to bty in than say a spider or levi(and theres not much blines anymore for tacnukes), and sharks are just popular since they are the smallest, highest nrg of all the small rusher(1,2,, and only has like 300 less nrg(which is made up by its insane recharge) than say a normal terrier rusher; which is alot bigger and gets hit more. Its also easier to rush than the bigger rushers in some ways since it has good speed/thrust so it doesnt lose all its speed( and have to spend a long time regaining it )by a repel.

[Unix]

Well... For one thing, Terr doesnt have the fastest bullet speed, WB does

 

What I'm trying to get at is not to even out ship usage, I do agree that there will always be some ships used more than others, but let's not make it so obscene where everyone is pretty much in ships 5/8 (and 1/2) in a base with a few lanc's since they're absolutely needed.

 

It's kinda sad to see 50% of the team in terrs, 40% of the team sharks and the remaining 10% to be in a lanc and other misc. ships. (This is not including 1/2)

 

How many wzl's have you seen that are effective in a base? How many spiders have you seen effective in a base? Or even better, how many of ship 3/6 do you ever seen on a team being used?

[Sharpflame]

I think levi is a useful ship, and possibly very good in center. It has a ton of energy, you can run through a length of String of Pearls and be almost untouched. A levi with a lot of + energy prizes will take a long time to kill, and, if you've got aim (Skill factor #1!) you should be able to pick off ships while they try to kill you. Levi is also very customizable. You can set it to snipe people with prox bombs, or close-range combat with bombs like HE Missile and Salvo. It's probably my favorite ship I have had this reset.

 

What I'm trying to get across is, even though you don't see much levis, they can be useful in different ways. Just not so easily like the other ships. Not many terriers take down my levi.

 

Although I hate it now. It sucks compared to Warbird.

Edited April 25, 2008 by Sharpflame

[Acer]

Well... For one thing, Terr doesnt have the fastest bullet speed, WB does

 

What I'm trying to get at is not to even out ship usage, I do agree that there will always be some ships used more than others, but let's not make it so obscene where everyone is pretty much in ships 5/8 (and 1/2) in a base with a few lanc's since they're absolutely needed.

 

It's kinda sad to see 50% of the team in terrs, 40% of the team sharks and the remaining 10% to be in a lanc and other misc. ships. (This is not including 1/2)

 

How many wzl's have you seen that are effective in a base? How many spiders have you seen effective in a base? Or even better, how many of ship 3/6 do you ever seen on a team being used?

I see ship 4 a lot (because the bomb lines). And i see what your saying, but you can't really change what people want. But after i max out one of my ships i'll by a spider or a wzl. I think the wzl is vary good in a base game. I see you rushing with your wzl and killing mostly 1/2 of our team. But like i said you can't change what ship people want, perhaps If different people saw how the wzl owns in base they would buy it. But i doubt it.

 

Edit: Perhaps if you lower the cost of exp on the wzl maybe new players would relize it doesn't cost that much to get it and they might get it. Just a thought.

Edited April 23, 2008 by Acer101

[Deathmonger]

The spider needs some attention. Probably in the form of faster guns and/or higher recharge. Right now it's a "less useful meat shield than a lanc".

[Suicide_Run]

Shark is a avg-good rushing ship that requires only....100k (+ ad if you have money) to rush effectively. While other ships will needs the same or more but is bigger in size so ppl go for sharks instead.

 

I think ppl use terr cause you have the speed which spid dont since if nme pushes, you can retreat fast enough so you wont get killed. Not to mention terr has more recharge than spid.

[Kilo]

The main problem is that terrier and spider get a very similar selection of equipment. The extra energy on spider is nice but ultimately cancelled out by its larger size, slightly lower recharge, and harder maneuverability. Still, it's not terrible, but middle ships will be more popular obv.

[Unix]

Shark is a avg-good rushing ship that requires only....100k (+ ad if you have money) to rush effectively.

 

An average rusher? Wow, it's easily the best rusher in comparison to other ships. Just from some experiences alone, I've seen two shark rushers be able to push a team just the two alone all the way through the bases. These sharks are insanely overpowered, because not only are they able to compensate for the lack of energy via far greater maneuverability, but also the ability to literally rush passed the enemy cluster and do many things. Antideath just makes it even easier to do it.

 

Shark rushing is without a doubt going to be this resets version of the old wzl. Before it was either wzl or you couldnt rush, with a few sharks, soon it'll be shark and maybe a few terrs can rush. I've spoken with other rushers who use terr, and they've all agreed, the shark just outclasses them too easily when it comes to rushing, and many of them are converting to rushing in a shark rather than a terr. Even I've considered it.

 

Spider just isnt worth the investment because of it's lack of usefulness in a base. Especially when you have high speed sharks coming at you dodging everything that comes by, and the spider needs to be closer than a terr because the bullet speed is less, and the ship speed of the spider is also less. How do you expect the spider to be better than the terr if it has to get closer to the enemy, and if it's in danger it can move up.

 

The levi is useful ship, I never said it was overused or underused, in fact I think it's one of the few ships that's used in the right amount. (Well now since there arent those super great blines).

 

I'm not saying that all ships should be equally used, but what I am saying is that ships should be more balanced out, rather than the obvious disparity that the ships right now have. Whenever I see a wzl or spider used in a base, I am kinda shocked, other than myself I cant think of another successful wzl in a base, and I have yet to see a super successful spider.

 

(I wouldnt of chosen wzl as my rushing ship, but some items were changed after I had the wzl, so I have to make due, which is the only reason why I'm not a terr or shark now).

[Syrith]

Give me enough money and i'll make a good spider rusher.

Also, sharks are NOT overpowered.

[9vgnc3eZ01]

We should notice the power recharge has on ships. Hey, Shark too strong? Nerf its recharge. Spider too weak? Then Buff its recharge. Terr slightly too strong? Slightly nerf its recharge. These solutions all work, and don't make the ship's owner complain if thats all that is nerfed.

 

Maybe the weasel will get its fix with more recharge, too. I think its worth a shot.

[Raw-Tard]

i do agree that sharks r a pain n the anus, its bad enough thier hard to hit, even when u spam bullets at em, but they slip past any bl w/ little hesatation, then once they p!@#$%^&* up the bl and sit n the lances face (after ad) they have plenty of options, ie: coffin lanc, get flags, or burst/rep !@#$%^&* enemy.

 

But the biggest pain frum sharks is that when they slip past enemy and make it to fr, they have the nerve to walk right back out of the base w/ little to sum difficulty. Imo the recharge and rot of sharks should b nerf'd b/c of their frequent annoyance.

 

But i'm not saying this will solve anything b/c if u nerf shark, then wb/jav rushers will appear n sharks place. IDk wut to do about the situation but the frequent leaks/breechs r increasing as time develops

 

 

EDIT: i've noticed that emp's have been getting a bit of a notice within item drawbacks, i've tried abusing the wzl's double bounce bombs w/ tacnuke, its not as good as one would think. the only purpose i c the bombs r useful for is bty'ing, and thats tough even w/ double b batteries since tac is an ammo guzzler. if a wzl cant rush, or bty, lets at least get sum dignity and help it b/c the last place i wanna c a pretty wzl is n center.

Edited April 24, 2008 by Raw-Tard

[Unix]

Well to be honest, a WB/Jav rushing isnt something I'm all that afraid of compared to a shark rushing. The recharge on those two ships make it so they're not "that" serious of a threat compared to the shark, and the shark also has more energy than either ship. Either way, those two ships arent much of a problem and never were when it came to being overpowering in a base.

 

Shark is just simply overpowering and needs to be somehow nerfed so that way other ships can be used to rush. I have no problem with the shark getting by enemy lines every so often, but dont make it so any newb can get in it and byp!@#$%^&* the entire defending party and go straight for the lanc and flag room.

 

As for EMP, give shark and wzl the use of cyclone, EMP doesnt do much of any damge anymore unless you get those items which specifically make damage larger. If you do that, I'm sure more people will be more than willing to use wzl and shark, but at the same time nerf the shark in one way or another so that it doesnt get so amazing. Idk what the exact problem is, maybe the shark is just too fast, too maneuverable? Could be a lot of things, or a mix of things, the end result is clear though.

 

Even though the shark isnt allowed a sig, even though it still isnt allowed a capacity, not only is the shark able to play on par with the other rushing ships, it sets rushing on a new level.

[Raw-Tard]

Bottom Line

 

i do agree that wb rushers and jav rushers rn't a threat by any means, but it doesnt mean they cant become a threat.

 

if u throw cyclone out for availability, i'm sure around half of the terrier rushers will happily change to a "nerf'd,setting changed" wzl

 

Sharks need lower maneuverability, lower recharge, and stripped of beam array

 

i know 1 tile of a difference doesnt seam like much, but sombody here doesnt understand the struggle of gun spamming that little shark.

ie: 1 shark reps, setting up burst spam

2 u spam bullets while pushing forward.

3 its profile is so low that by the time ur bullets reach the shark its quikly double bursted.

4 u pray ur bullets hit the $h** out him.

5 the dust is cleared, the shark dies, u die (do to the double burst + ur pressed bullet spam)

6 last but not least, u tach to lanc and the shark has Ad but only this time the process doesnt work b/c the shark has gained enough speed and momentom to easily by p!@#$%^&* u and the lanc w/ little damage.

 

GG

[Unix]

Cyclone can be made for EMP ships only, which is what I was trying to get at, seeing as how EMP is what allows cyclone to be used now.

 

Like I said, Idk what needs to be done about shark, but something does need to be done, for all we know it could be as simple as decreasing recharge, who knows.

[Raw-Tard]

for sum odd reason i think arnk knows since he was the one of the first (if not the first) sharks to hit up the zone since setting changes.

 

n e wayz, i got skewl tommorrow AFK till arnk nerf's crap.

[Syrith]

if you can't effectively kill sharks with your gunlining ships, you're a newb who can't aim/predict where they're going to be a second later. Their recharge and energy is NOT too strong. Sharks already have a very small selection of items.

 

Don't complain about how everything is overpowered, just find a way to counter it. It's as simple as counting to 3. (and if you can't figure out a way... your IQ must be incredibly low).

[Unix]

If it were that easy then there wouldnt be a problem.

 

Shark = BEST recharge and respectable energy stats considering it's small profile.

 

Guns are easily repped, also, cloaking sharks are a huge advantage since most dont carry xradar, and the selection of items is fine. Even with what it has available, it's still an overpowered rusher.

[Suicide_Run]

I can easily see why Syrith say that. Seriously, sharks arent all that hard to kill but you know why they keep slipping pass

 

Its cause the defending freq always has a larger # of btyers than attacking. That leads to ppl keep moving back and when sharks tries to slip pass the btyers dont bother aiming at them if they passes them. They just keep on shooting on their bomb/gun lines.

 

But if you people seriously want to nerf the shark, stop trying to whack it's stats. Just remove its ability to buy Anti-Death and your done.