consider this

[aquarius]

I'm pretty sure the mentality in HS is 'feed me'. It's not entirely about skill here, it's about being active.

 

The only thing to feel 'pro' about in Hyperspace is owning small children who don't understand the complexity of space ship combat. And that's not very pro..

 

The money system is nice but is applied too strictly, money is everything. We could make a much larger list of items and delete this money all together. Then, it would be completely about how well you can configure your ship, how well you can perform with it, and how well you can customize eight full ships. No money, no exp limits. With the ability to ?toggle setups (have more than one setup for each ship), players could have a load of fun creating different variations of each ship.

 

In my humble opinion, it's a very good start to eliminate money. We'll get rid of all the hustlers. The main reason is simple. Let's say, I love HS a lot, but I must work eight hours a day, raise a son eight hours a day, and sleep five hours a day. That leaves me with three hours a day, and what do you think I'm doing with those three hours? Trying to bust a Hypernut. I can't.. Since I can only play three hours a day, and sometimes three hours a week, I have no exp or money. The elimination of limits would allow the true fans to come back. If I don't have the time, I don't play, period. There are probably dozens of HS die hards our there who love the zone but play Trench Wars instead because they just don't have the time to work their way in Hyperspace.

 

Bases are also a big factor and should be changed. They need to be a lot wider, zero choke points, more, less powerful bomb-lines. Therefore, you need more skill to defend, rather than needing more skill to attack. Winning should require the most effort, this is currently not the case. If you and your team are trying to win the game in a wide open base, you'd all better be good pilots. Wider bases will prevent amateur dominance.

 

We need an upgraded freq manager, and a lock on setfreq...

 

Setting the flagdropdelay higher wouldn't hurt either.

[Sound]

I've talked with aquarius for a while about this and agree with everything, and i want to add this to readers minds:

We realize that without money and exp there's no common goal to continue working towards - there needs to be a new common goal. Currently, players continue working towards exp to make signatures available - That's the kind of goal we need. Money and exp can be implemented but the main idea is to not make it crucial to success (as is current, more money/exp = win.)

So feel free to contribute with common goal ideas.

Edited February 29, 2008 by Sound

[Russky]

if you remove it i doubt as many people would play and a lot of the vets will complain how some noobs come to the zone and and own them

[Dr Brain]

You don't need a huge time investment to get a decent ship. Yeah, you need a lot of time to get the "best" ship, but skill is far more important.

 

Money and exp have been an important part of the game for so long that I don't see them going anywhere any time soon. That's not to say we can't make it easier on casual players, but dropping our central theme probably isn't the way to do it.

[Deathmonger]

Without quibbling about the definition of 'huge time investment', 'decent ship', or 'skill', I can understand where Aqua's coming from with respect to the new setts.

 

Take a basic working warbird setup, for example. (I can't exactly remember the old settings costs so bear with my recollections)

 

Old setts:

WB: $500

Retro: $6K +30-50% thrust

Toka: $8K +30-40% recharge

Close Combat (x2): $5K ($10K)

 

Total: $24.5K

 

This would be your basic warbird that can hold its own in center. How would you build that today?

 

New setts:

WB: $500

Pulse: $5K

Retro: $10.5K +20% thrust

Comp Core: $11K +5-10% recharge

Defense Mount (x2): $8K ($16K)

 

Total: $42.5K

 

Income Adjustments:

Ammo Costs: -20% (!@#$%^&*uming $1K worth of ammo gets you $5K worth of kill income)

Bounty Slowdown Adjustment: -?%

 

Cost-Adjusted Total Cost: $51K in "old sett" dollars

 

It takes at least twice as much playing time to get a ship that isn't as improved/effective as a basic config in the prior setts. That's without taking the increase in bountying difficulty into consideration, or consumable costs like thors or reps. In order to make "upgrade room" for the signature items while keeping the max stats similar to prior resets, the lower and mid-level upgrade effectiveness has been downgraded.

 

The net result is the average player progress is less than half the speed it was before, so people who aren't on all day long may feel more disadvantaged. Maybe slowing down player progress is the intent so that people don't max out as quickly--I'm not making a judgment--I'm just running the numbers to try to explain where players like Aqua are coming from.

[»D1st0rt]

If I ever get enough time there will be other things to work for, I've made a good deal of progress as it is

[Choose Profile]

Aqua you are definately right about the large price increase of items, but you fail to realize how easy it is to get ~50k these days. During large pub games I can backup lanc without firing a single gun/bomb and make ~1k a minute from mooching my teamates kills. ~50 minutes for a center WB is not bad at all IMO.

[Manivo]

You forgot Maneuvering Fins and Inertial Dampener

[Unix]

In all honesty, it is harder to make money. 1/3 of leech money instead of 1/2. The further away you are from people, the less leech money you get. Bnty only increases by 5. Somehow the jackpot seems to be growing slower. Items costing more, consumable items....

[Sound]

There is no denying that it's harder to make money.

Bounty rises by 5 instead of 10 = 1/2 as much money gain right there.

JP, because of that, rises 2x as slow.

Things cost more, + constant ammo and consumable cost.

It's obvious that money comes slower, but that's not the point.

Imagine HS with hundreds of different items to choose and hundreds of different setups for your ships, to create any duty, with no cost - All based on skill. And fun with money gain is still there with something to work towards buying.

[Guest Xun Yu]

THat would be cool. However, right now with these settings... My jav has limited choices:

 

1)retro is so similar to omega

2) I can't really tweak my ship, I can just buy items which are supposed to contrast, yet don't

[Hiro]

if you remove it i doubt as many people would play and a lot of the vets will complain how some noobs come to the zone and and own them

 

Personally , I agree with this. Make no money, be able to toggle anything, but make the signatures still here. When you get like 5,000 kills or something, the signatures become available and You can upgrade your ship. In response to russky's post, I would definitely play this zone if this happened, and as for the noob thing. If a noob that played for 10 days can "own" a vet, then that vet either sucks very badly, or the noob is very pro, and thus, is not a noob.

[aquarius]

If a noob that played for 10 days can "own" a vet, then that vet either sucks very badly, or the noob is very pro, and thus, is not a noob.

 

or the zone is balanced

[Unix]

or the vet wasnt really a vet and they depended on items and was a newb in disguise.

[Sound]

That's the current settings in use. A first day player (noob) doesn't stand a chance against a player who's played for a month (vet) simply because the month player has more money on his ship. The first day player could have played SS for 5 years, and the month player, well, a month! With this new system, the first day player (true vet) is evenly matched, at least in ship. Time doesn't determine who wins or loses, it's all in your brain to make the best setup, and in your skill. The true noob should always be crushed by the true vet!

 

There won't be those newb's in disguise as vets, hiding behind items.

[James1293]

There are probably dozens of HS die hards our there who love the zone but play Trench Wars instead because they just don't have the time to work their way in Hyperspace.

I'm leaning more towards other games for this reason also.

 

Money and exp have been an important part of the game for so long that I don't see them going anywhere any time soon. That's not to say we can't make it easier on casual players, but dropping our central theme probably isn't the way to do it.

I agree with Dr on this one. Money shouldn't be completely eradicated; that's half of HS's attraction.

 

Some brainstorming ideas...read if you feel like it

Spoiler! --Click here to view--

1)increase bty gain speed by...5+? that way pros will actually do better (i've seen players--like me -- that

have nice ships, but can't keep bty because they aren't "pros")

2)make a lot of things cost less. As i said already, money is half of hs. If you take it away completely, HS has a faster "bored speed" since you have almost nothing to work for. If things merely cost less, the money appeal isn't gone.

3)perhaps Brain was thinking of something else...? "That's not to say we can't make it easier on casual players..."

 

I know these ideas have problems, but like i said,

it's just brainstorming =D

Edited March 3, 2008 by James1293

[tiss61]

i think hyperspace was way better before all this ammo and nerf crap. now hyperspace is all about centering. no one even base anymore because it's pointless. the person who made these setting probably tired to balance the zone but now all it did is unbalance the zone to defenders too much.

[Hiro]

That's the current settings in use. A first day player (noob) doesn't stand a chance against a player who's played for a month (vet) simply because the month player has more money on his ship. The first day player could have played SS for 5 years, and the month player, well, a month! With this new system, the first day player (true vet) is evenly matched, at least in ship. Time doesn't determine who wins or loses, it's all in your brain to make the best setup, and in your skill. The true noob should always be crushed by the true vet!

 

There won't be those newb's in disguise as vets, hiding behind items.

And that, my friend, is why 3/4 of the people that have tried hs have quit, Vets or "newbs"

[Syrith]

MAKE A 2ND ARENA WITH TRIAL SETTINGS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Sound]

tiss61 is right about the basing. Every time i see a flag game going on, i work to be on the defending team if i feel like getting 50k, because i KNOW that i will get 50k+ by my bountying. Rushing is harder now, and less rewarding. Who uses the most money? Rushers. I lose 1-2k per game rushing. Sure that's not much... But i used to gain 30k? And compared to my defending? I gained 100k defending the other day. !@#$%^&* no i don't want to rush now. The only reason i rushed was to test out my new items.

 

James i noticed that your only reason behind not supporting dropping the money was the lack of the main goal. We can brainstorm for that main goal.

Maybe money which buys addon types that only slightly modify ships power.. and somehow are really awesome =o

Try brainstorming for that main goal, james, and you might find it worth considering.

 

Syrith, a second arena would be abused by people who want to try out shipsets before they buy them. A second arena would also require a Lot more items to give the full effect of the possibilities this idea proposes.

Edited March 4, 2008 by Sound

[Kilo]

If you're losing money doing anything in a full game, you're doing something wrong. Only time I lose money is if I decide to overkill on bursts in some small 6v6 game or similar. Besides, attacking is all about taking the base so you can defend, not sitting in a stalemate with your opponent. The bases are rigged to defense though, so it's not easy to overtake any given base (but it's done in any given flag game where people put effort in.) Hopefully we can get some balanced bases soon.

[Sound]

That's what happens. 10 levis pile up on that one BLine in i forgot which base, and it ends up being a stalemate - moving back and forth in base for an hour, while i'm losing money. I only begin to gain again when we take base and i start defending with bty.

And that's what's wrong with the current bases - But let's stay on topic...? I guess it is the current settings that favor defenders in that a rich defending ship (terr,lev) can easily dominate the weak rushing ship ( rich or not) with one or two bombs.

Edited March 4, 2008 by Sound

[Syrith]

Syrith, a second arena would be abused by people who want to try out shipsets before they buy them. A second arena would also require a Lot more items to give the full effect of the possibilities this idea proposes.

 

How is that going abused? It'd be a good idea to know what you're getting into. Would you buy property without checking on the details of it?

[oid]

Make sell prices the same as buy prices, so I dont lose a bunch of money every time I wanna to change my ships around. Edited March 4, 2008 by oid

[James1293]

Make sell prices the same as buy prices, so I dont lose a bunch of money every time I wanna to change my ships around.

 

Dr will never do that; he's worried people will abuse for bty gain (and other things...?)

 

I've asked before