Levis w/PD

[Deathmonger]

Adding PDs to levis had changed the game in a few ways.

 

1. Rocket-laming is more effective with salvo + L4 bullet spam coming at the target.

 

2. The tactic of closing with a levi and killing it at short range has been largely countered. You have to engage levis now from long range, unless the PD is distracted or you can circle faster than it can turn.

 

3. The base tank role is more effective because you now have a close-range weapon to attack enemy with.

 

4. PD is used as a short-term brick, as it hangs around after you die absorbing damage. I see a lot of levis positioning in front of bomblines to take advantage of this. However, with AD it has the disadvantage that it gives defenders something to shoot at while you're between deaths.

 

People were already using PD in this way with lancs, but I think that PD adds more value to a levi than a lanc so we're seeing a lot more of them. I don't think PD on weasels will be used much because you'd rather have a real gun in most cases.

 

Overall I like how it makes the levi less of a sitting duck in center, but I wish PD disappeared faster after you die.

 

[Edit] After seeing a few flag games it now appears levi is the rushing machine. Levis rule base rushing from now on. Also, it appears that PD follows the trajectory of the rocket after death, and then you reappear at the PD site, so it reintroduces the feature from the old days where when you rocket your debris momentum after you die will carry you way past the defenders and respawn on the other side. With the levi's fast rockets it can carry quite a long ways.

Edited December 3, 2007 by Deathmonger

[ArcticxWolf]

Adding PDs to levis had changed the game in a few ways.

 

1. Rocket-laming is more effective with salvo + L4 bullet spam coming at the target.

 

2. The tactic of closing with a levi and killing it at short range has been largely countered. You have to engage levis now from long range, unless the PD is distracted or you can circle faster than it can turn.

 

3. The base tank role is more effective because you now have a close-range weapon to attack enemy with.

 

4. PD is used as a short-term brick, as it hangs around after you die absorbing damage. I see a lot of levis positioning in front of bomblines to take advantage of this. However, with AD it has the disadvantage that it gives defenders something to shoot at while you're between deaths.

 

People were already using PD in this way with lancs, but I think that PD adds more value to a levi than a lanc so we're seeing a lot more of them. I don't think PD on weasels will be used much because you'd rather have a real gun in most cases.

 

Overall I like how it makes the levi less of a sitting duck in center, but I wish PD disappeared faster after you die.

 

 

Yea but thats only if you're the levi...Imagine being a warbird trying to kill a levi with pd, salvo, and rockets...would be next to impossible

Also, for the Wzls, i still think its cheap, because with real guns, you cant rush as fast, and pd kills wbs faster than you can dodge it.

[JoWie]

Point 4 is probably easily fixable

[0KYO]

arcticx me i can kill one lol

 

KEEP THE PD ON LEVI!

[cdrom]

all pd did is promote levi rushing, but it has its disadvantages.(imaging 5 pd levis or more trying to be summoned to a lanc, it just wont work well), so all you have to do is brick a couple of them, and you might stall the pd rush for a few valuable seconds

[Arry]

I think it's taken away the weaknesses of a levi and made it too powerful. There's no weakness to exploit against a pair of levi rushers. Everyone who played a shark to rush seems to have switched to a levi. All signs point to.... unbalanced! Edited December 8, 2007 by Arry

[tcsoccer and neptune]

Good, get rid of the sharks!

[11___________]

I am fine. Levi rushers don't seem to be horrible. a couple reps into a defending bombline fixes everything.

[Suicide_Run]

I would prefer going against Levi Rush over Shark Rush anytime. A few reps will push a rocketing levi back and once they run out of rockets, they are hardly a big threat.

 

Btw, levi rushing with PD does have its bad points like stated above. You cant attach so you have to be summoned which sometimes take a while if everyone on ur team is using summon as well. If you managed to sneak behind the enemy and grab flags...you cant get out.

 

The only thing I see a problem with is that if you die, the PD will stay there for a few secs absorbing the bullets/bombs. But that can be a bad thing since if your smart and pay attention, you can tell if the levi has AD or not. Cause if they do have AD, their PD will remain there, if not it will disappear before the levi get respawn.

[zephoid]

im torn. i realy like pd on my he levi for center cuz i can actuly use it alone without getn raped like before. It isnt overly powerful cuz levi is still slow as heck but it is actully usable now.

but i also think the old zpm salvo rocket levi was just re!@#$%^&*ed as it was, and didnt need to get more powerful. instead, NERF THE ROCKETS. make m alot slower but last longer for levi, that way they just add a boost for like 15 secs to get away from danger but not to break through a serious gunline in a base or rape a turret in 1 p!@#$%^&* easily. i always end with the same reasoning. WHY DO WE HAVE ARTILLERY THAT CAN OUTRUN FIGHTERS???

[Sharpflame]

I think this is what zephoid sorta suggested up there: Tanks should not be moving fast as an IceFire warbird... ever.

 

The Spider lost its rockets, but got a speed (and thrust?) upgrade to make up for it. And the Spider is still not fast for having all the firepower it does right now.

[zephoid]

btw, u can now attach with pd and it dies when the ship dies.

[tiss61]

I think it's taken away the weaknesses of a levi and made it too powerful. There's no weakness to exploit against a pair of levi rushers. Everyone who played a shark to rush seems to have switched to a levi. All signs point to.... unbalanced!

i totally agree, pd on levi is chaos for defending base cause:

1.) levi can absorb all the bullet/bombs

2.) levi can also rush well and slip past enemie with 2 rockets

3.) on the way past enemie the pd weakens everyone so badly it makes the rest of the attacking team easy to rush

so yea, it's really bad that levi have pd. there's almost no way of stopping a rushing levi w/ pd unless u have a lanc with !@#$%^&* lots of burst OR having 3 spiders ALL shooting at the levi

[Guest Moose Master]

PD for levi needs to be removed. It's too much of a lame trick to be left in the game as a single levi with PD and AD can now hold back a full pub freq. All they need do is repeatedly fly at the enemy and the PD takes care of the rest.

 

It's no longer fun. Either PD or AD needs to be removed from lev, preferably PD.

[Aceflyer]

Easy fix: remove Energy Infusion from Leviathans. ZPM Leviathans have 3500 energy; with EI that is up to 7000 energy per life, with AD you are going to need to go against 14000 energy with level 4 PD bullets and rockets. Maybe a few Bursts and Thors too.

[Matrim Cauthon]

having 3 spiders ALL shooting at the levi

thats not hard, considering pub games are like 20+ players, its only a challenge for a 7 man priv team

[tcsoccer and neptune]

Easy fix: remove Energy Infusion from Leviathans. ZPM Leviathans have 3500 energy; with EI that is up to 7000 energy per life, with AD you are going to need to go against 14000 energy with level 4 PD bullets and rockets. Maybe a few Bursts and Thors too.

 

 

6998 which is extremely hard to get, so basically a max of 6900, and that would be lucky too, because if you get damage in bases, it usually comes in huge clumps of 500 or so energy gone. You'd be lucky to EI at under 100, and that means you're going up about 12000 energy with ad energy infusion leviathans. My point; its impossible to EI at 0 energy.

[Sention]

all pd did is promote levi rushing, but it has its disadvantages.(imaging 5 pd levis or more trying to be summoned to a lanc, it just wont work well), so all you have to do is brick a couple of them, and you might stall the pd rush for a few valuable seconds

 

Levi rushing was around long before PD and it will be around with or without PD.

 

I think it's taken away the weaknesses of a levi and made it too powerful. There's no weakness to exploit against a pair of levi rushers. Everyone who played a shark to rush seems to have switched to a levi. All signs point to.... unbalanced!

 

PD takes away the weakness of a levi? PD doesnt make me any faster last time I checked. If you think theres no weakness to exploit against levis, then you havent found your repel button. Its incredibly easy to stop any levi rusher with a few reps, which every ship has. All signs in this post point to... a cry baby!

 

I think this is what zephoid sorta suggested up there: Tanks should not be moving fast as an IceFire warbird... ever.

 

The Spider lost its rockets, but got a speed (and thrust?) upgrade to make up for it. And the Spider is still not fast for having all the firepower it does right now.

 

Taking away rockets from a levi makes the levi worthless for anything other then bomblining. Spider doesnt need rockets because all they do is fire bullets. Take away rockets from the levi and you turn it into a bomblining ship which just promotes the exact thing that is wrong with HS basing. Attacking and rushing is where its at, not bomblining.

 

 

i totally agree, pd on levi is chaos for defending base cause:

1.) levi can absorb all the bullet/bombs

2.) levi can also rush well and slip past enemie with 2 rockets

3.) on the way past enemie the pd weakens everyone so badly it makes the rest of the attacking team easy to rush

so yea, it's really bad that levi have pd. there's almost no way of stopping a rushing levi w/ pd unless u have a lanc with !@#$%^&* lots of burst OR having 3 spiders ALL shooting at the levi

 

1.) Since when do levis absorb all bullets/bombs? I seem to die quite fast when i run into a huge bombline unless i repel, which any other ship can do.

2.) Levi isnt the ship to slip past enemy with 2 rockets... the shark is. Have you seen a levi without its rockets? If you think you can slip past a team after you use your rockets your sadly mistaken.

3.) PD doesnt really do anything to anyone with half a brain because they just repel the levi while its rushing and after it has no rockets the levi/PD very slow and vulnerable. If you think theres almost no way of stopping a rushing levi you need to play more and improve your skills. Its that simple.

 

PD for levi needs to be removed. It's too much of a lame trick to be left in the game as a single levi with PD and AD can now hold back a full pub freq. All they need do is repeatedly fly at the enemy and the PD takes care of the rest.

 

It's no longer fun. Either PD or AD needs to be removed from lev, preferably PD.

A skilled levi can hold back a full novice pub freq, sure. But then again, give a skilled player a shark, and he will do the same. Its not the ship thats at fault, its most pub players lack of skill and knowledge of the game.

 

Easy fix: remove Energy Infusion from Leviathans. ZPM Leviathans have 3500 energy; with EI that is up to 7000 energy per life, with AD you are going to need to go against 14000 energy with level 4 PD bullets and rockets. Maybe a few Bursts and Thors too.

 

Lol people had this same stupid math when the levi had 4k nrg and cried back then just like they do now. 14k energy on a levi sounds great to me... too bad your math sucks.

 

Funny thing is most people who posted negative views on the levi are newer players. This thread was about PD on a levi and quickly turned into a levi nerf thread. The levi doesnt need a nerf, you guys need to learn how to stop them. Most decent players know how to stop a levi and its been stated time and time again how to do so. If you want to beat the levi, get in game and practice your skills and stop wasting time whining on forums.

[BlueWyvern]

I'm happy with levis as they are now.

[tcsoccer and neptune]

Taking away rockets from a levi makes the levi worthless for anything other then bomblining. Spider doesnt need rockets because all they do is fire bullets. Take away rockets from the levi and you turn it into a bomblining ship which just promotes the exact thing that is wrong with HS basing. Attacking and rushing is where its at, not bomblining.

 

Duh? The levi was meant for heavy bombing, and the spider was meant for heavy gunning. If attacking and rushing are where the basing problem is, then taking away the rockets on levis would help. Why make a heavy bomber faster than the heavy gunner, in my opinion, they should be around the same speed, and have no rockets.

[Sention]

Taking away rockets from a levi makes the levi worthless for anything other then bomblining. Spider doesnt need rockets because all they do is fire bullets. Take away rockets from the levi and you turn it into a bomblining ship which just promotes the exact thing that is wrong with HS basing. Attacking and rushing is where its at, not bomblining.

 

Duh? The levi was meant for heavy bombing, and the spider was meant for heavy gunning. If attacking and rushing are where the basing problem is, then taking away the rockets on levis would help. Why make a heavy bomber faster than the heavy gunner, in my opinion, they should be around the same speed, and have no rockets.

 

Did you even read anything I wrote? How is attacking and rushing where the basing problem is at? Learn to read... its the complete opposite. People dont know how to attack and rush because all they do is hop on the defending team so they can bombline. Making the levi a heavy bomber aka bombline ship means it serves no purpose but bomblining/safelaming which means you either give us a new rushing ship capable of doing what the levi does, or you ruin basing completely and turn basing into nothing more then money farming bomblining.

[»Ceiu]

Actually, as far as typical roles go... the levi SHOULD be a slow bomber ship that pretty much holds down bomb lines. It's counter-part (the terrier) should be the rusher. We have 8 ships to work with. Each should serve as a yin and yang for the roles in this zone.

[tcsoccer and neptune]

In football, do you use a really fat guy to run the ball? No, you use a quick guy that can run fast, and dodge people.

[Neenja]

Taking away rockets from a levi makes the levi worthless for anything other then bomblining. Spider doesnt need rockets because all they do is fire bullets. Take away rockets from the levi and you turn it into a bomblining ship which just promotes the exact thing that is wrong with HS basing. Attacking and rushing is where its at, not bomblining.

 

Duh? The levi was meant for heavy bombing, and the spider was meant for heavy gunning. If attacking and rushing are where the basing problem is, then taking away the rockets on levis would help. Why make a heavy bomber faster than the heavy gunner, in my opinion, they should be around the same speed, and have no rockets.

 

Did you even read anything I wrote? How is attacking and rushing where the basing problem is at? Learn to read... its the complete opposite. People dont know how to attack and rush because all they do is hop on the defending team so they can bombline. Making the levi a heavy bomber aka bombline ship means it serves no purpose but bomblining/safelaming which means you either give us a new rushing ship capable of doing what the levi does, or you ruin basing completely and turn basing into nothing more then money farming bomblining.

 

Isnt that the point of a levi? A levi isnt supposed to be made to RUSH, or else it wouldnt have been called a HEAVY BOMBER. It would have been described as a TANK. The levi is SUPPOSED to hold the bombline, and if you put it that way, then what do sharks do? all they're supposed to do is rush the enemy? what else do they do? NOTHING. What do spiders do? gun the enemy. What else do they do? NOTHING. What do wzls do? Emp the enemy. What else? nothing. The reason why the levi is able to have so much nrg, it isnt supposed to be exploited to rush, but it was actually meant to be used for tacnukes, because they take up 700nrg to shoot one bomb.

[Sention]

Actually, as far as typical roles go... the levi SHOULD be a slow bomber ship that pretty much holds down bomb lines. It's counter-part (the terrier) should be the rusher. We have 8 ships to work with. Each should serve as a yin and yang for the roles in this zone.

 

In a perfect world... but too bad this zone is far from perfect and our ships arent balanced. If you replace the levi rusher with an appropriate ship (the terr) then this would be fine, but the terr sucks. 8 ships is right, too bad only 2 can be used to rush effectively atm... and you want to take away one of those and make it a pure shark rushing zone? Fix the terr and maybe wed see more variety in basing.

Edited December 12, 2007 by Sention