PoLiX Posted October 16, 2007 Report Posted October 16, 2007 Updated: 12:59 p.m. PT Oct 15, 2007 CHICAGO - Julio and Mauricio Cabrera are gay brothers who are convinced their sexual orientation is as deeply rooted as their Mexican ancestry. They are among 1,000 pairs of gay brothers taking part in the largest study to date seeking genes that may influence whether people are gay. The Cabreras hope the findings will help silence critics who say homosexuality is an immoral choice. If fresh evidence is found suggesting genes are involved, perhaps homosexuality will be viewed as no different than other genetic traits like height and hair color, said Julio, a student at DePaul University in Chicago. ... http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21309724/?GT1=10450 Interesting... I don't believe their is a gene really, but anything is really possible.
rootbear75 Posted October 16, 2007 Report Posted October 16, 2007 reminds me of the Simpsons Gene where all simpsons' males became dumber as time went on
ThunderJam Posted October 16, 2007 Report Posted October 16, 2007 I say shoot them regardless :\AHHAHAHAHA
Aileron Posted October 17, 2007 Report Posted October 17, 2007 I wouldn't be so sure this was the first time this study is done. However - no. Genes determine the physical characteristics of a person, and homosexuality is behavior. It would be like a BMW driver traveling 25 mph over the speed limit, and then when he gets pulled over, blaming it on the auto engineer because the car was 'designed to go fast'.
»Maverick Posted October 17, 2007 Report Posted October 17, 2007 I doubt that, Aileron. I haven't ever heard such a thing about genes (being only specifying characteristics). (Not that I have read much about it.) Where does the "intelligence" of insects / animals come from then? If DNA can contain intellect then it must surely also contain behaviors (since it's part of intellect). I find it quite plausible that genes might be the cause for homosexuality. Homosexuality is part of the reproduction of our race (or; lack of) so it must have it's roots somewhere deep. Do we know enough about DNA and genes that we can already conclude it only specifies physical characteristics?If it's a behavior then where does this behavior quirk come from and why does so many people have it? They all got kicked in the nuts at a young age?
SeVeR Posted October 17, 2007 Report Posted October 17, 2007 (edited) I don't think we'll ever find a gay gene. I think we'll find a gene or a number of genes that increase the chances of being gay (much harder to search for) by being related to certain things like heightened emotions and other female characteristics. Then certain developmental situations during childhood would put the final nail in the coffin, probably during the iden!@#$%^&*y crisis all people go through in their teens when we attempt to explain ourselves based on our attributes. This teen-iden!@#$%^&*y phase solidifies any grey-areas and a grey-sexuality area could materialise into homosexuality. Edited October 17, 2007 by SeVeR
ThunderJam Posted October 17, 2007 Report Posted October 17, 2007 I don't think we'll ever find a gay gene. I think we'll find a gene or a number of genes that increase the chances of being gay (much harder to search for) by being related to certain things like heightened emotions and other female characteristics. Then certain developmental situations during childhood would put the final nail in the coffin, probably during the iden!@#$%^&*y crisis all people go through in their teens when we attempt to explain ourselves based on our attributes. This teen-iden!@#$%^&*y phase solidifies any grey-areas and a grey-sexuality area could materialise into homosexuality.I'm with sever on this one. Theres most definitely not a gene that clearly defines, black-and-white, whether your gay or not. Altho Aileron, gene studies find stuff that causes mental illnesses and such to run in families, so genes don't only cause physical attributes.
Aileron Posted October 18, 2007 Report Posted October 18, 2007 Yes, genes can cause a physical fault within the brain. However, that can't affect homosexuality because to do that is to consider homosexuality to be a neural disorder, one has to assume that possibility away because to hypothesise homosexuality to be a mental disease is a political correctness no-no. I mean, on some level to atribute one's entire behavior one's genes and environment is to deny one's own free will.
ThunderJam Posted October 18, 2007 Report Posted October 18, 2007 Yes, genes can cause a physical fault within the brain. However, that can't affect homosexuality because to do that is to consider homosexuality to be a neural disorder, one has to assume that possibility away because to hypothesise homosexuality to be a mental disease is a political correctness no-no. I mean, on some level to atribute one's entire behavior one's genes and environment is to deny one's own free will.Political corectness is a joke. The country is ruined by everyone trying to be politically correct rather than doing things that need to be done. Anyway, my rant aside, you could consider it a mental condition rather than a mental disease if you wanna be PC. And both sever and I said we don't think a gene would MAKE you gay, just increase your chances. In which case free will is still an option. As to saying that mental things are actualy physical faults in the brain. I don't think a family history of depression for example, could be attributed to a physical flaw in the brain. Like the brains physical characteristics actually being deformed...
SeVeR Posted October 18, 2007 Report Posted October 18, 2007 (edited) Well to some extent i do believe free-will is taken away in cases of homosexuality. Even though i believe genes only increase one's susceptibility for being gay, childhood developmental situations can help solidify homosexuality by causing one to identify more with the opposite sex during the teenage years. These situations have to take place during childhood and could be brought about by any number of issues such as sexual abuse, over-submission to bullies, a skinny body (in the case of males), and many more unforseen cir!@#$%^&*stances. The individual on the receiving end would have no control over the "psychological deformation" that would be taking place. So i believe gayness isn't chosen, but i think these geneticists are going down the wrong path to proving it. Maybe this is where we disagree TJ. Edited October 18, 2007 by SeVeR
ThunderJam Posted October 18, 2007 Report Posted October 18, 2007 Hmm, I can understand that in some cases it isn't chosen, and in some cases they maybe are born with it. But I also think there is a choice a lot of times too.
PoLiX Posted October 18, 2007 Author Report Posted October 18, 2007 I believe there may be genes that do give some affect, but I think upbringing also has a slight response to it in a way too. A friend of mine, who we all joke gives a new twist to !@#$%^&* bashing cause he's one !@#$%^&* who'll bash your !@#$%^&* (7'2" 280lbs), but he was NEVER allowed to see naked woman growing up, and only had sisters, and they we're the only naked woman he ever saw and that disgusted him when he did, so he found himself liking when he saw boys naked, and yeah. He talked about it all once with us when he was drunk, just began blabbin on about it. So in his case, upbringing probably fully affected him.
JDS Posted October 18, 2007 Report Posted October 18, 2007 'gay gene' was thought up long ago to kind of give a scientific (though fake) reason to gay people. Lots of gays who 'cameout' were sent to hospitals to try to be cured.. now they just take it to far personal choice is ALL there is to it
»Maverick Posted October 19, 2007 Report Posted October 19, 2007 That makes no sense, JDS. If there is this "gay gene" then going to the hospital will have no use.
AstroProdigy Posted October 19, 2007 Report Posted October 19, 2007 Ever think that maybe everyone is born bisexual and through raising most people reject people of their own sex, but some people, for reasons mostly determined early on go the opposite way or stay bisexual?
JDS Posted October 19, 2007 Report Posted October 19, 2007 maverick, there are different types of hospitals.. mentaly insaine hospitals is where you would have gone, the psycho ward.
NBVegita Posted October 19, 2007 Report Posted October 19, 2007 I agree astro, I believe ideally we are all born "bi sexual". It is our upbringing that forces us to one side or the other. Case in point in ancient cultures is was not unheard of, and sometimes common place for two men to engage in sexual activity. Now there is such a taboo over it, and we're told from a young age, no matter how "open" your parents are, that for the most part being gay is bad. And I would disagree that it is a "gene" that makes you gay, I do believe that it is upbringing, and a matter of how strong your mind/will is. As with polix's friend, some people would have gone the complete opposite. Instead of giving into the idea that the female body is bad, he would have gone the opposite way and ended up adoring the females, because of his lack of interaction at a young age. The idea that seeing men was a "safe" action is what possibly made him more keen to sleep with them. Also a fear of rejection also comes into play here. I could go on for hours, as back in college in a few of my psych classes we spent a lot of time on this issue, but ultimately I don't believe a gene is involved when it comes to sexuality.
ThunderJam Posted October 19, 2007 Report Posted October 19, 2007 It is our upbringing that forces us to one side or the other. Case in point in ancient cultures is was not unheard of, and sometimes common place for two men to engage in sexual activity. Now there is such a taboo over it, and we're told from a young age, no matter how "open" your parents are, that for the most part being gay is bad.You sure? name a few ancient cultures like that. I'm pretty sure we are way way way more accepting of homosexuality now then people have been in the past. Isn't that why you here of famous people from the past keeping their homosexuality a secret? Because it was a bigger deal then. Another thing I've thought of is, if people want homosexuality to be considered natural, why don't we see it happening in nature, meaning animals? Maybe there are some animals that do it that I'm not aware of.
SeVeR Posted October 19, 2007 Report Posted October 19, 2007 Well it depends on what ancient civilisations you're talking about. Since the age of Christianity began we've been killing homosexuals left right and centre. But if you go a little bit further back it wasn't always that way. Ancient Greece for instance.
NBVegita Posted October 19, 2007 Report Posted October 19, 2007 Greece, Rome, a lot of civilizations pre-Christianity. Then Christianity told us it was wrong.
ThunderJam Posted October 20, 2007 Report Posted October 20, 2007 Greece, Rome, a lot of civilizations pre-Christianity. Then Christianity told us it was wrong.The old testament said it was wrong too. That's before Jesus and therefore before Christianity existed. Still waiting to see well known accounts/instances of it happening in ancient cultures.
Dr Brain Posted October 20, 2007 Report Posted October 20, 2007 Biology 101: Genes are tied to evolution. Genes that prevent reproductive activity get weeded out. Genes that promote reproductive activity get more prevalent. Over millions of years, any gay gene would have been weeded out to the point that it would be *much* rarer than things like six-fingered hands (since that doesn't affect reproduction). If there's a gay gene, it's not what drives the majority of the gay population.
Recommended Posts