priitk passing the client on..what do you think

[★ freakmonger]

didn't you quit grav?

[Gravitron]

Freakmonger: Actually, I had discontinued Gravitron (stupid forum admin banned my other name) and have infact quit for the most part (I visit league on occasion to have a prac or duel).

 

Kirk:

1. For an example, I do recall a hearsay (perhaps by Ekted? uncertain) of Priit claiming he could've easily made continuum to support unlimited ships but that would requite redoing of the server and that he's not going to bother with that and that it wasn't required for the current gameplay (zones). So yes, leaving things to Priit -- nothing will get done on subject of furthering the game. Currently, the most development done on that front been from grelminar (!@#$%^&*S), CatID (mervbot/SS clone client), snruuub (linux client) and Bak (continuum clone client).

2. I do believe that SubGame (and definitely INF's daemon) does authenticate the client on some level (forces an update on a faulty checksum?), be there really a need for a third party to preform this? After all, the lion part of the cheater base is users who been handed down cheats. SS had fairly a low amount of programmers throughout the years and a mere three or so, at most, of them actually went about to crack the game and develop cheats for it on their own. The protection of client memory...well, this be a whole another issue (as said, some things must be authenticated by server, if not initially then (as INF does) retroactively).

[★ Admiral Kirk]

On point one, yes I think we all agree that thier is too much wrong with SS (protocol, client and server software) for anyone to consider worth fixing.

 

For point two, of course thiers no reason that it needs to be a 3rd party app, I was just expaining how they did, doesnt mean it cant be done with a fully indegrated solution. The idea of the 3rd party app however, was to make it possible to keep the security elements closed source and therefore more difficult to tamper with, while keeping the client and server open. Obviously closed source != completely secure, just makes it more difficult.

 

Does anyone else relize that this is a completely useless (hardly even acidemic anymore) conversation but that none of us can seam to resist posting again and again?

[★ candygirl]

I agree with Kirk this being a completely useless topic.

[★ doc flabby]

A good banning system and watchful mods are a far better solution than any automated cheat detection.

[★ freakmonger]

good banning system as in better than BanG

[jacob hunter!]

He should give it to death. He would make subspace/Continuum better.

[★ candygirl]

pfft ya right!!

[Gravitron]

What's wrong with death? It brings much needed peace to tormented souls.

 

http://animatedtv.about.com/library/graphics/sp106death_1.jpg

[jacob hunter!]

lol thats not what i mean

[★ candygirl]

lol thats not what i mean

 

yep we don't no what you mean so

[L.C.]

My problem with this issue is that if the source is givin into the wrong hands, for instance someone who has as poor organization and professionality as ASSS does, I'd probably end up leaving. Personally, I don't want to see crap organization and unprofessionality in Subspace or Continuum - VIE wasn't like that. Atleast they were better at it than whoever decided to organize ASSS the way it is now.

 

When it comes to flexibility and how far you can take features of all kinds (ie. modular support)...

(!@#$%^&*S ~ Linux) > (Subgame ~ Windows)

 

Overally it's quite frankly the opposite.

(!@#$%^&*S ~ Linux) < (Subgame ~ Windows)

 

Any newby would choose Windows over *nix or *nux. That kind of operating system is for advanced users; the problem with absolute suckups who want to have all Windows machines converted to *nix or *nux is that they are forgetting that *nix/*nux doesn't speak at the "customer's level," which is why Microsoft is so successful for a nice part of the business. Seriously, too many folders, too many files (and confusing ones too!), and too much complication to its degree. I think a newby could more easily learn to use Subgame quicker than ASSS.

 

I don't mean to start any arguement. If an arguement should occur, a moderator should split the arguement replies into one thread for argueing this subspace on ASSS/Linux vs Subgame/Subspace/Windows. Anyway... :\ If I were in PriitK's place, I'd probably be extremely cautious with who would have the source code. Just like my maps for Half-life: Sven Co-op, I just don't feel the trust in the public if I were to release my work as open source. I just feel the fears of what might happen to it (like something going 'terribly' wrong).

[MikeTheNose]

LC, we don't want general computer users running servers

[BDwinsAlt]

LC, we don't want general computer users running servers

 

A server owner should know a good bit about computers and how they work anyways. Who wants an idiot running a server? Here is what I think. If you know how to use Windows, but not Linux, use Windows. If you have experience with Linux and you can work with ASSS, USE LINUX. Do whatever is best for you. Personally I like Linux better. There is nothing wrong with running a server on Windows though. On topic: I think the council members should decide on a trustworthy person (with priitk there to witness). One person should be given the source. I wonder if Mr. Ekted secretly has the source. He did create the menus and stuff. Make Ekted update it.

[Witchie NL]

I agree with the fact he needs to p!@#$%^&* on the source code to keep this thing active and alive.

I think he needs to start working on improving the games functions but since this isnt going to happen (atleast i guess) he could always p!@#$%^&* on the code to some other trusted coder.

[Gravitron]

My problem with this issue is that if the source is givin into the wrong hands, for instance someone who has as poor organization and professionality

Do you realise that you've just ruled out about 95% of this so-called community?

[11___________]

So basically...many upon many subspace players depend on one person to do 1 update with 1 security code. This game's future isnt going to be good.

[Beethoven]

As for reversing the encpryption for Ctm and creating a new client that could pose AS Ctm? Yes its possible, the Ctm encryption has been reversed by a particularly gifted individual.

 

I wouldn't really call myself gifted, but extremely curious.

 

But yes, there is no way I would ever release it to anyone. The only person who has a copy is PriitK.

[★ D1st0rt]

My problem with this issue is that if the source is givin into the wrong hands, for instance someone who has as poor organization and professionality as ASSS does, I'd probably end up leaving. Personally, I don't want to see crap organization and unprofessionality in Subspace or Continuum - VIE wasn't like that. Atleast they were better at it than whoever decided to organize ASSS the way it is now.

 

When it comes to flexibility and how far you can take features of all kinds (ie. modular support)...

(!@#$%^&*S ~ Linux) > (Subgame ~ Windows)

 

Overally it's quite frankly the opposite.

(!@#$%^&*S ~ Linux) < (Subgame ~ Windows)

 

Any newby would choose Windows over *nix or *nux. That kind of operating system is for advanced users; the problem with absolute suckups who want to have all Windows machines converted to *nix or *nux is that they are forgetting that *nix/*nux doesn't speak at the "customer's level," which is why Microsoft is so successful for a nice part of the business. Seriously, too many folders, too many files (and confusing ones too!), and too much complication to its degree. I think a newby could more easily learn to use Subgame quicker than ASSS.

 

I don't mean to start any arguement. If an arguement should occur, a moderator should split the arguement replies into one thread for argueing this subspace on ASSS/Linux vs Subgame/Subspace/Windows. Anyway... :\ If I were in PriitK's place, I'd probably be extremely cautious with who would have the source code. Just like my maps for Half-life: Sven Co-op, I just don't feel the trust in the public if I were to release my work as open source. I just feel the fears of what might happen to it (like something going 'terribly' wrong).

 

I don't have time to do a point by point, but let me just say that I strongly disagree with you on many of your arguments.

[Gravitron]

And sage386 who has already done it after ctm.38.

[★ Dav]

The thing is any anyone is running a server and requires a basic user interface to do it then id be inclined to question their ability to run a server in the first place.

 

Its always been my impression that people running servers are the more tech savvy among us who wouldn't have a problem adapting to Linux.

[BDwinsAlt]

The thing is any anyone is running a server and requires a basic user interface to do it then id be inclined to question their ability to run a server in the first place.

 

Its always been my impression that people running servers are the more tech savvy among us who wouldn't have a problem adapting to Linux.

 

I completely agree. If the owner has issues, they usually have a sysop who runs everything for them. Some people are scared of Linux and don't like Windows ASSS so they just stick to subgame and bots (which is fine). How do you expand the gameplay if you limit yourself? Subspace gets boring after you play the same thing over and over. ASSS makes things a little more complex and allows you to do more.

 

On topic: We need a small team of devers who constantly update the client like GunZ does. Patches and Fixes should be released at least once every 3 months. The only question is who would be working on that project. I vote Grel as the Head of the project with PriitK as a supervisor in his spare time.

[L.C.]

My problem with this issue is that if the source is givin into the wrong hands, for instance someone who has as poor organization and professionality as ASSS does, I'd probably end up leaving. Personally, I don't want to see crap organization and unprofessionality in Subspace or Continuum - VIE wasn't like that. Atleast they were better at it than whoever decided to organize ASSS the way it is now.

@To those who disagree

 

 

 

Has it ever occurred to you that PriitK just possibly might be thinking along the same lines? I definately would be. I do with almost 100% of my work! Seeing such maturity, professionality, organization, and formality from PriitK and his fellow development aides on how Continuum was designed and structured, I think this does hint just what kind of people they are and how they like their work to look like and be. PriitK is a Skype Developer for goodness sakes! I have used Skype before (nothing new) and it looked very much along these lines about "maturity," "professionality," "organization," etc - EVEN THOUGH there are other people (perhaps with more control) working with him. That does not change too much.

 

Think about it. PriitK continued it this way. Why? His "heart" shows through the work of Continuum in all angles.

@!@#$%^&*S Would you even bother? Why?

 

 

 

EDIT :: I have to add - VIE was like that and so is PriitK. Why make the game or client look dirty? I consider the server related material just the same. There's no reason for the dirtiness. PriitK continued and he didn't make it dirty. I want to open up something that looks clean, attractive yet simple, and makes a good impression to me.

Edited February 26, 2007 by L.C.

[★ D1st0rt]

Oh I get it, you're just a hater

[Gravitron]

Au contraire Dav, those who are tech savvy are smart enough to create macros, cronejobs and simplified admin CP GUI so that they may better manage and monitor their system instead of having to do everything the hard way.

Early Windows was a GUI mounted on top of DOS...you could've done the same things over DOS...but why work hard?

The purpose of an application GUI isn't to allow the clueless Joe Jr. to run his own services but rather to ease the job of someone who's already in the know.