The Ol' Days

[Outnumberd]

Here is a screen shot from about 2 1/2 years ago... When the zone was extremely awesome.

We need to put it back to this somehow! I miss it tons.

 

The setting of this screenshot:

I (wobbly) told everyone to attach for a Jav squad and had about 12 total. Bran Man was among us but switched freq's and then told his freq to be Levi's. Well, we no longer were able to smother the zone and the Jav squad was broke up. This is a shot from the middle of our fun.

 

[Wild Luck]

wich zone are u talking about?

[X`terrania]

17th parallel.. i think i'm going to cry now.. i miss the old days.

[CRe]

Ahh the good old days yea they were good

[X`terrania]

WHO THE !@#$%^&* ARE YOU

[Outnumberd]

Nothing Defeats those good ol' days. Is there nothing we can do to rebuild it?

Don't you guys remember how awesome rumble matches were with like 20 javs in the game.

Even when we had rumbles going we could go to the public and there would always be a game going on.

[Emblazon]

If it was as easy to do as it is to say it, someone would have figured it out by now. It's not like the Head Sysops that have been in the zone have been trying to keep it the way it is. If you have suggestions, please, share them. The zone has been in this funk for 2 years, and numerous things have been tried. Everyone always has their opinions on how to make the zone better, some very vocal. The zone was on the edge of death only months ago, when we had that 0-3 population maximum, 2 being bots. And at least now, usually at least once or twice a day, we do get a decent game going in public. There isn't much different from the zone as it is right now from what it was 2 1/2 years ago. Some will argue that point, go right ahead, because few actually know what they're talking about.

 

If you havent noticed lately, most of the zone's javelins don't play anymore, which is part of the reason 17th is still in this funk. The javelins gave up on the zone because the zone had pushed them aside to focus on the entire zone and not just one group. The problem with these people was that they didn't care about the zone or the players as long as they had their precious jav and jav events, that's all that mattered to them. Remember when the bullets were changed in rumble to yellow? Same damage, same cost, same everything but color and sound, and these jav players flipped about it.

 

But anyway, back to the issue at hand. If you have suggestions, please share them because a lot of ideas have been tried, a lot have been ignored. Now that may sound bad, but if a guy suggests to us something we've already tried and has already failed, it is redundant to try another persons version of the same idea. I do have a feeling that statement will draw Delic to post here, which is all good. Delic used to be most vocal about his ideas for the zone. However, most of them were just ideas that would make 17th gameplay mimic that of another zone that he played.

[X`terrania]

Why is everyone turning this into drama?

[Emblazon]

what drama?

[Trip']

Either that, or people just got bored of the game. Games tend to have that side effect.

[Incomplete]

There was no need to change the bullets in rumble though. If its not broken then don't fix it!

 

The idea of focusing on pub was a good idea, i just dont see why jav events had to be !@#$%^&*ed with. I don't see why javvers would stay if the only thing that kept them here was changed.

 

Then people were being banned for having a strong opinion on something which was stupid, only people that should be banned are hackers. 17th can't afford to lose any population even if it is only 1.

 

Also everything is out of date, the website, maps, information, pretty much everything. You should maybe recruit someone who's job specifies on keeping things up to date

 

Alot of damage has been done and I think its too severe to resurrect from. I'm upgrading my PC soon and all the old stuff can be a reward for the winners of a huge league.

 

Stuff includes a 120gb hard drive, ddr 400 256 ram and a Geforce4 graphics card. I know the only decent thing there is the 120gb hard drive but they cant complain because its free.

[Delic]

If it was as easy to do as it is to say it, someone would have figured it out by now. It's not like the Head Sysops that have been in the zone have been trying to keep it the way it is.

They kept it the way it is by refusing to change their stuck up, stubborn minds about the messed up gameplay they created and that we're still stuck with today.

 

If you havent noticed lately, most of the zone's javelins don't play anymore...

Javelins? You mean the ones who used to play back in the days?

Yeah, sure. Most of the other ships don't play anymore either, so there's no need to discriminate the poor javelins.

 

...which is part of the reason 17th is still in this funk. The javelins gave up on the zone because the zone had pushed them aside to focus on the entire zone and not just one group.

Please don't speak for every javelin who left the zone. People left for various reasons, and the zone was hurt because it had basically been based on the jav since a long time back. This is what Vile wanted to change, and I wasn't against that, because basing the zone on one group is indeed a bad thing, but it's not that group's fault if you can't make events that they like. And you don't need to ruin what the javelin pilots like about the zone to switch focus. All you had to do was offer something better maybe, or at least something that appeals. Unfortunately, staff never succeeded on doing that, and that's why people left. If I remember correctly though, the most players this zone has had in recent days was during a jav event ;/

 

The problem with these people was that they didn't care about the zone or the players as long as they had their precious jav and jav events, that's all that mattered to them.

That's a quite silly and contradictory comment man.

Of course they käre about the events they like. And those events were for the biggest part of 17th history what actually gave 17th an iden!@#$%^&*y, those events were what made this zone successful, and that's not an opinion. If you look at the history of this zone, you will see that it's a fact.

I was as much of a pub player as most players once upon a time you know, and I wasn't the only one who stopped playing pub after the unnecessary changes occurred.

I think this whole Javvers vs. Pubbers thing is very silly, but I can't blame the javvers who decided to stop playing pub, it's completely understandable in my opinion.

Pub needed to be upgraded, built on. The possibilities were there, but upper staff at the time couldn't see them and decided to go another route which proved fatal.

And that's not an opinion either. As for them not käring about players, wätäfäk? Come on man haha, what the !@#$%^&*.

 

Remember when the bullets were changed in rumble to yellow? Same damage, same cost, same everything but color and sound, and these jav players flipped about it.

It was a stupid and unnecessary change to begin with. All it did was cause annoyance, and it did effect the gameplay.

It actually does effect your performance (to an extent) if the way things look is changed and you're used to how they looked originally.

That's why I didn't even play when Vile put up the old ships settings, but in different ships in Halloween some years ago >;P

 

But anyway, back to the issue at hand. If you have suggestions, please share them because a lot of ideas have been tried, a lot have been ignored. Now that may sound bad, but if a guy suggests to us something we've already tried and has already failed, it is redundant to try another persons version of the same idea. I do have a feeling that statement will draw Delic to post here, which is all good. Delic used to be most vocal about his ideas for the zone. However, most of them were just ideas that would make 17th gameplay mimic that of another zone that he played.

Heheh, actually I read and type a reply to one point at a time >;P!

Of course I have to disagree and say that you either don't know what you're talking about or just lie for some reason.

The ideas I offered would've suited 17th's gameplay and theme perfectly and I have explained why a lot of times.

If you can tell me why not then I'd be a happy bunny. !@#$%^&*, the zone description even implied that it was turf flägging, when it was actually based on soccer.

It's not like DSB has patent on turf flägging. And besides, when I gave my ideas I was a 17th-only player, so what you said is very untrue.

The ideas I offered weren't even mine originally, I just built on ideas that STAFF HAD THEMSELVES ;D before EO and DW resigned and everything went to !@#$%^&* >;P!!

But to be honest, as things are now, I don't even want you to try the ideas I presented.

Actually I'd be happy if you deleted my Control and NewOldMap arenas.

[Telson]

how sad that the forum is alive more than the zone itself. Change this.. change that, it wont matter because the game limitation were reached long ago. 17th tried everything. There is no problem with the zone, its the game itself thats the problem. atm, 17th is back to the oldday sets and oldday map (minor edits) and yet people still dont play. The game is simply dieing. first you have the key people in the community stop playing, get married or go play wow. Then small zones with no healthy pop and oldschool subgame gameplay, that have internal issues start to die off. Then those who are left migrate to the more populated zones. Years go by, technology advances and 2d shooters become a thing of the past. go ASSS or accept it because this game is going nowhere.

[CRe]

WHO THE !@#$%^&* ARE YOU

 

My Answer: I AM YOUR FATHER

[X`terrania]

I like Incomplete's idea, we should cooperate with other zones to get this tournament put across..

[Delic]

Yes, that's another reason to why the zone is dead Telson, I agree. But I wouldn't say it's the only reason.

There's other "small zones" who've managed to stay alive or even gotten more people, so.. yeah..

[Incomplete]

Just because the old generation of players have gone doesn't mean we can't attract the younger generation

[Vile Requiem]

The problem is that 17th has nothing that would attract the younger generation. In direct compe!@#$%^&*ion with TW, DSB, HZ, and MG, a "free for all" zone is not going to win in this era of Subspace. The only reason that the vets stayed around as long as they did in the face of the various problems 17th has encountered was nostalgia.

 

Despite the horrible management of Complex, it still almost worked as a transition for the zone. (Quite frankly, of everything I've seen in this zone, how Complex went down pisses me off to no end, but that's another story). Now Halo is using a variant, and as such it's too late.

 

As it is, 17th needs ASSS in the worst way, and to run with some crazy new idea that'll get the kiddies all excited. Fortunately Snoo and Cord are pretty smart guys, so there's a shot.

[Incomplete]

You need more than just new settings, maps, events etc.

 

For now if nothing can be done you should advertise it, make flyers and hand them out on the street or something, graffiti it all over walls if you have to

[The Cubbies]

Yah, the Macy's Thanksgiving Day Parade is soon. Perfect opportunity.

[Telson]

haha a giant flying subspace logo rolling down times square. People would be like "WTF" omg that cracks me up.

[Aileron]

Um, Inc, if a person need computer parts wouldn't they be unable to play subspace due to broken computer.

 

Speaking of which if your harddrive can work with my Dell Ispiron 1100 laptop, I'll take it. PLLLZZZZZ??

 

 

17th's problem with attracting new members is as follows:

 

17th takes skill to play. You can't get a kill with one shot. You can't ignore your energy meter. You can't be blissfully unaware that your opponants might use cloak, stealth, mines, specials, etc, yet on the other hand you can't use said specials to lame people over and over for huge ratios.

 

Furthermore, we are not SVS. Thus if one wants to spend time learning skills in order to play, he might as well learn SVS settings so as to have the "official" skill set.

 

Worst of all, pub is a different skill set than our leagues. If you want to play in leagues, you learn how to play in an all-jav environment, which is not pub. The principle problem here is that the single ship leagues remove any incentive for players to learn the pub skill set.

 

Also enter the fact that we really have no special draw, not a critical fact in and of itself, and boom...no niche, no new players.

 

And keep in mind text based MMORPGs are still being played, so as bad as our graphics and 2Dness is, there's probably still going to be room for subspace for a while.

 

That being said, what we probably should do is just keep the zone on life support until that Continuum 3D comes out and then make sure 17th3D is one of the first zones there, and when we do either have multi-ship leagues or make pub the same as the league is.

[X`terrania]

Um, Inc, if a person need computer parts wouldn't they be unable to play subspace due to broken computer.

 

Speaking of which if your harddrive can work with my Dell Ispiron 1100 laptop, I'll take it. PLLLZZZZZ??

 

 

17th's problem with attracting new members is as follows:

 

17th takes skill to play. You can't get a kill with one shot. You can't ignore your energy meter. You can't be blissfully unaware that your opponants might use cloak, stealth, mines, specials, etc, yet on the other hand you can't use said specials to lame people over and over for huge ratios.

 

Furthermore, we are not SVS. Thus if one wants to spend time learning skills in order to play, he might as well learn SVS settings so as to have the "official" skill set.

 

Worst of all, pub is a different skill set than our leagues. If you want to play in leagues, you learn how to play in an all-jav environment, which is not pub. The principle problem here is that the single ship leagues remove any incentive for players to learn the pub skill set.

 

Also enter the fact that we really have no special draw, not a critical fact in and of itself, and boom...no niche, no new players.

 

And keep in mind text based MMORPGs are still being played, so as bad as our graphics and 2Dness is, there's probably still going to be room for subspace for a while.

 

That being said, what we probably should do is just keep the zone on life support until that Continuum 3D comes out and then make sure 17th3D is one of the first zones there, and when we do either have multi-ship leagues or make pub the same as the league is.

 

opponent*...

[kentbrockman]

you know, if every one of these people who said that 17th was dead.. every one of these people who state whats wrong with the zone... every one who makes ideas on how the zone can improve... if every one of those people played for just 2 hours a week, 17th probably wouldnt be dead..

[Incomplete]

I'm in 17th all the time.

 

Aileron, people who want extra computer parts could still play, it doesnt really mean they have a broken computer. Maybe someone has a 10GB hard drive and wants to try win the 120gb one. Maybe someone has an older graphics card etc. Or they can just sell the !@#$%^&*.

 

One of the problems with 17th is what Aileron stated, you need skill to play the zone, the people who still play have skill so when someone new comes in they get totally owned and of course the newb will leave subspace / 17th.

 

Another problem is there is nothing to do in 17th when the population is low.

 

17th is out of date too! Not just the zone but the website too and that will probably never get fixed because there either isn't enough staff or staff or too lazy to do it.

 

17th is a violent place too. I'm not sure what its like now because I haven't played a decent pub game in ages. But you get people saying "stop lagging !@#$%^&*face" and then it starts an argument (I know because ive been in enough of them) Why would a newbie want to get involved in something like that?

 

You need some cool events, multiship AND just the javelin. I know this isnt urgent because you have no one to play them yet. But you should probably get to work on them incase the population does come back.

 

If someone designs some type of advertisement for flyers then I will give a load out.

 

Maybe you should concentrate on getting more people like Mentorian, Miami dolphin, pen experse etc.. because they always end up balling. Balling games always lost a lot longer than just center killing.

 

If i can think of anything else i'll post it