Caerbannog

I didn't see you make a turret while down players at any time. You had a 3 man turret when other freqs had 2 players on them. Lancs are fine with just one bounce. --- Related to the thread as a whole; I prefer fixed bullet damages to the random up to 300 damages. Dunno about building squads. Yes, bigger freqs at all times _might_ help for that. It can also turn on you, SkyRakers got too big, most players in the arena were your squadmates, and generally shooting at one another was frowned upon. Also I do not know where all these people you would get for your squad would be coming from. Some sort of a dynamic setting would still be the best imo, the real SVS settings are too punishing with low pop. If the settings are closer to 2011 settings, I'd still keep the freq sizes lower for a longer time, just so there's more chaos since even the 50 bty ships you spawn with are good enough to fight with.

Close bomb EMPs freezing your own energy. Oh, and you could kill yourself in SubSpace via closebombs. (still works in the tutorial v 1.34 IIRC) Did you make up your mind on where you stand on bonuses yet? "Hunters" being able to !bonus speed was a horrible thing for you a few threads ago. Now not having bonuses hurts turrets? What?

I totally agree. Really? Then why are you crying about not being able to use bonuses, a 2000+ feature for two weeks? P.S. I, too, prefer Lancasters with one bounce. Two bounces make it a silly superzoneship. Oh, and terriers with slow fire rate. Pew pew. The added extra aim should be enough, when you're done being a newbie, move on. Oh, and weasels with Self-EMP. I kind of wish PriitK hadn't forgotten that.

That's why i suggested building 20-30 dumb bots for the newbies to have something to shoot at. If i let the newbie kill me Hallu will accuse me of gifting and BAN me and remove the 2,000 bounty kill from the newbies record. Then the newbie would be REALLY confused. First, you seem to use "hunter" as a synonym for "pro players". Assuming you're not talking about league players as a reference to "Pro League", still a weird analogy. Second, it doesn't matter who does the killing. I did not say that it does. Your original point was no less valid after I pointed out that you minerepel newbies if you can. Although I will go on and state that a minerepel is the WORST way you can kill a newbie. It makes zero sense to them, they're not low, they die. I've seen this happen in real life a few times. I've never seen you let a newbie "gun you". Not even for two seconds. Most people in the zone won't give them a fighting chance. Even if I ever do it, I feel stupid doing it. And I feel like the newbie feels stupid too with someone obviously toying with him. And no. You did not suggest dumb bots so that newbies could kill them. You suggested bots so that you could kill the bots, and kill the newbies trying to kill the bots. You know it. I know it. Everyone knows it. Like we previously discussed; the original Subspace comes with "Tutorial", where you get to kill drones. Go download it. Not that bots would be all bad, if only used in a ?go tutorial arena for target practice etc. EDIT: Newbies do not even know what a record is. They also won't contend for winning a category. They won't be confused.

You can still earn them, you just cannot use them. Also my "site" is up again, http://carefactor.110mb.com/SS%20Files/ship.gif for images that need resizing (and then re-rotating). Luckily I forgot how to record an action set for PS so I can't do this in 5 minutes

Gadianton said: "This basic building block in the food chain gives REAL newbies some thing to shoot at and to be able to kill. As it is right now, a newbie joins and gets 1 kill and 50 losses fighting pro players." Or a newbie joins, can't find you on the map, and when he eventually does you minerepel him with your turret. He won't even know what happened. But keep pretending you're doing good deeds to the population. -- There's a built in problem with a single newbie scenario though. Pretty much no one in the zone can play with them without killing them 50:1 if they want to.

My brother saw his friend playing SubSpace. My brother paid said friend the standard Internet fee at the time to play on his computer, as we had no Internet. My brother and my friend, and another friend who had tried SubSpace, then talked about the game without me ever having seen it. The conversations were remotely like this: "Did you try to just lob them in a javelin and run away? it's so fun and you never die!" "Yeah but I liked terrier and just flying at them more." "Those damn spiders got me all the time, I never find the key for x" ... Repeat for a while and I'm all like whoa what's all this? Sounds cool and awesome, maybe I'll try this game once I finish editing this Duke Nukem 3D level. Then again, back in the day I could log on at pretty much any time and find A Koala Bear linebombing and 40 to 90 other people flying around. Nowadays, you'd have to start from a 5pm on a Sunday warzone event for guaranteed action. Then get them hooked enough for them to come back.

I can't even tell if you're joking since your last list with 160 ideas to improve the zone looked much alike, as did 1/2 damage level 1 EMPs for weasels while defending turrets. In either case, most of your suggestions are bad. Safe zones? Sure, good riddance. 10. is moot. 4v4 only allows 1 turret for a good reason; it does not mean 4v4 players do not like turrets. In fact if 4v4 players ever play pub they're either flagging, or turreting. Probably cause they cannot do it in 4v4 arenas. Last but not least: If turrets, or people who run, weren't harder to kill than suicidal negs, there would be no term "hunter". The chase is half of the experience, more than that really, since if you work in a group you don't care if you get the kill yourself or if you help your friend get it.

Nooo don't do the retro weekend (saturday only please) until someone refits the old ships to 32x32 which is the current ship size. I have the gfx somewhere.. let's see

i prefer weasels with emp bombs that do 1/2 damage. i prefer weasels only have level 1 bombs i prefer weasels didnt ever get rockets. Point is that mines have always lasted for 2 minutes. If you want to mess with the mines why not mess with the Weasels settings and hurt the hunters favorite ship? Cutting the time in 1/2 helps hunters and hurts other play styles. o ya i forgot this is a hunter only zone. all other play styles should be criticized to death, and the settings should be modified to kill them. By your "it was always this way" logic, your half the damage level 1 EMPs should not be the case, or your preference. Also I see where you might be coming with the thought that level 1 EMPs would be weaker on a weasel, since you fight from one screen away, but level 1 EMPs with the ability to fire bullets right after (and then throw in another bomb that costs very little to fire) are goddamn lethal at close range. You know, like the shark was for a while before what it is now? Although it had _increased_ cost of firing bullets, and shitty recharge. Didn't you call it the lamest ship of them all?

So that you have to choose between teammates and being able to lay 5 mines when you want to. You were never supposed to get everything for free in this game / zone. I'd guess the standard of 12 also had something to do with having 90 or 120 players on 7 man freqs (mostly) and the maximum number of overall projectiles on a map. Or maybe it was just a sophisticated guess and an arbitrary number of mines it took to cover large areas

As ive said before, i dont really use bonuses .... thats why i green But i think thats a good idea ...... id say reset everything at the official RESET. Itd make more sense. Just as your score, stats, etc all go to zero, so do your bonuses I think Caer points out a major problem and how it could be used to abuse the system by saving up bonuses. Not only how it could be... but how it has been To some degree, I've done it. And one of Sika's turrets used way way waaaaaaaaay more bonuses than they earned. This was when !bonus devour was there too. Oh. While on topic of bonuses, and Gadianton. He was whining about how the cost of !bonus defense was changed, along with his other usual lines of "it should remain unchanged for eternity". He seems to actively have forgotten that the CD release did not feature bonuses. Not that the CD release is in anyway holy, but it's a sort of a standard "SVS" setting

Chaos Zone is not supposed to be fair. You're always supposed to stack the odds in your favor whatever your own personal goal is. Swarming and turrets are prime examples of this. As is a flagging freq, or a hunter freq. Hunter freqs are rare nowdays from what I can tell though. There's no real competition or point, as the targets just run to safezones and stay there until the hunters leave. Their lameness has overcome the amount of time the hunters can put in. This was not always the case. Gadianton wants to play for ratio. He does that well by today's low standards. There's not one bit of honor, and very little skill in how he does it though. He has always whined about this game being built for hunters, which it is not. But when you're the ONLY target in the zone, it will seem that way. He has made very little valid points in the past. Ever. Jazz wants to "play" this other game where you purposefully try to bring ratio players' ratios down, or help hunters with bounties. That's fine. It's always been fine. EDIT: PsyOps didn't say chaos should be oriented for hunters, phew. Well he did, but didn't mean to. As for public coordinates or energy or repels, there's no way in hell any number of moderators will be able to enforce a rule with any logic that would prevent this, unless you set a strict messages per minute threshold, which kind of makes me chuckle even when I type it out. In either case, if it were ruled out I'm pretty sure Jazz would discover the wonders of "bounty at %coord macros, sent to the freq with 1-2 people who seem to be going after bounty. Gadianton, please post the list of changes that made the game easier for hunters and I'll reject it point by point. I'm bored.

heh I already had this new feature ready to release when Nude started this thread. I called it 'fullship' (!bonus fullship). Caer -- I *think* you mean that bonus points should only accrue for kills when they meet the same threshold that streaks have (>75 bty)...? (I can think of at least three diff ways to interpret "tie bonuses to streaks") I'm not surprised to see vets advocating to get rid of bonuses and (particularly) ranks. They break the game design of Chaos imo. See item I.h in my Chaos Philosophy doc (which I mostly wrote in 2002) http://chaos.sscentr...chaosphilosophy Making bonuses only available from Safe would at least take that advantage out of real-time game play. I think launching 120 bursts in a row (which I could do right now with my 80 bonuses) is a game-wrecking ability/terrible game design. Similarly, if you've been hunting someone and have caused them to use up their toys, they shouldn't be able to just prize themselves new ones in an instant. --hallu Oh, I don't mind which streak you interpret it as so much, as long as it is somehow session based instead of gathering 50,000 points which converts to manymany bonuses in one reset, then being able to use them for say, a kill death ratio run in the next. That makes no sense in my head. I'd opt for all kills myself, the same the bot spams as Godlike! at 38:0.

Regardless of price, safe zone or not, etc. you guys missed (the obvious fix): Tie bonuses to streaks. You need 500 points for 1 bonus, you need 3 bonus for !bonus speed or !bonus booster, that's 1500 points. That's a lot of 70 bounty kills. Streaks already give you super and shields, at 10 and 35 kills or something. Those are always fun, when timed correctly.

Newbies. Don't they know that the people in chaos zone could link them to russian tits way faster than they'd accomplish this feature while browsing through all the dicks (or so I head) on chatroulette. The people on CNET from Hallu's post cannot be very smart, if they could not find the place to remap your keys.

I recreated the old SS helper in flash a few years back (although I did redo the textboxes' contents), I think you can find it from chaos zone's website... or from my secret links. I had a brief chat with Hallu and whoever else was on our staff chat about video instructionals of "This is a repel in action" too ... the settings might be zone specific, but I don't think any zone uses speed=0 or negative sucktion repels

As a previous chaos addict, now a spec lurker, the runners we have in the zone today would've been fantastic back in the 70+ population days. Nowadays when we have 5 players, it just kills the zone quicker. I'm a bunny of dynamic things myself, it covers both ends. If we could have dynamic green amounts / ratios (as in what's in the greens) / arena size / freq size, it'd be great. The !bonus system is an obvious downfall of spawning 100%s .. helps suiciders quite a bit.